Why Torah only? vs christianity/NT?

Well here goes but before I do I will be using Torah and Tanakh (thats old testament to some) to prove my argument and comparing it with the NT.

Note I will not rely on anything other than these books although there may be some opinion. I use an approach which does not interpret to my own understanding but in the context of what is written (I do theorise with some of this though, as a matter of logic if you like).

I will add to this post as and when I can, I will try to answer questions as well as I can but if you want to debate please provide sound logic to your argument (I will) otherwise I will not respond.

Finally before I start this subject matter some questions to Xtians:

According to my understanding JC came to offer a way out for sin through himself. Didor has he achieved this?

Is JC a diety or equal in status to G-D?

Who did JC come for Israel or Gentiles?

Is G-DS word pure, refined, intrinsic?
Does G-D change? (before you answer there is a difference to changing and relenting).

 

Will soon post my thread but not now because I am just thinking where to start.

 

Thanks for opening the thread, but I'd be grateful if you would prefix your references to us by our Saviour's proper title, "Christ", hence "Christians". Apart from the fact that "Xtian" may simply not be understood by a few, contracting "Christ" to "X" was historically a deliberate insult by whoever dreamed up the word "Xmas", especially given the occasional negative connotations of the letter and the fact it is not found in the title "Christ". I'm quite certain you meant no insult, though.

Onto your questions. I should stress that these are simply my own interpretations and will doubtless vary from those of my fellow Christians;

Not sure what "Didor" is, but yes. This is not to say that those who have accepted Christ are sinless, but that we are forgiven.

I freely admit, I've never understood the difference, if any. But if you accept that an omnipotent being, who is also unbound by any law of Physics, can also split into two, any apparent paradox is solved.

All mankind.

I feel that the Bible, or indeed any of the major religious books, have been DE-refined by sheer force of the fact that different versions of them exist. In addition, it is difficult enough to preserve the original meaning when translating from, say, Greek to English, but when you attempt to carry the meaning of tens of thousands of words into modern English, you will inevitably lose something.

For example, the word, "Love They Neighbour" would seem to contradict the Commandment "Thou Shalt Not Covet Thy Neighbours Wife", until you go to Bible Study class one fine and someone thinks to tell you that the word "Neighbour" does not simply mean a person who lives in the house on either side of your own.

I also feel that the surest way to receive God's word is via prayer.

No. He is perfect, and therefore unchanging.

 

With respect to Christ no insult intended. Didor should have been, did/or.

I will continue with this post when I can really busy now and my broadband stick is damaged (by my daughter) so limited access to net right now.

Oh yes I will also refer often to the Tanakh as a whole and not just Torah for those who do not know what the Tanakh is it is Torah, prophets and writings or the Old Testament.

I believe that the Torah is the law, command and instruction G-D chose us to follow and the rest of the OT is actually to support how to go about living this way of life in all situations.

So until I can reply happy holiday to all.

 

I wrote:
Is JC a diety or equal in status to G-D?
I quote from Isaiah and the Torah.
Exodus 20:
"3. You shall not have the gods of others in My presence. ?. ??? ??????? ???? ????????? ???????? ??? ??????:

Deu 6:
4. Hear, O Israel: The Lord is our God; the Lord is one. ?. ?????? ?????????? ????????? ?????????? ????????? ?????:

3. You shall fear the Lord, your God, worship Him, and swear by His name. ??. ??? ????????? ????????? ??????? ??????? ??????? ?????????? ???????????:

14. Do not go after other gods, of the gods of the peoples who are around you. ??. ??? ???????? ??????? ????????? ???????? ????????? ????????? ?????? ??????????????:

Deu 32:
12. [So] the Lord guided them alone, and there was no alien deity with Him. ??. ????????? ?????? ?????????? ?????? ?????? ??? ?????:

39. See now that it is I! I am the One, and there is no god like Me! I cause death and grant life. I strike, but I heal, and no one can rescue from My Hand! ??. ????? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ????????? ???????? ????? ?????? ?????????? ?????????? ??????? ???????? ?????? ???????? ???????:

Isaiah 45:

5. I am the Lord, and there is no other; besides Me there is no God: I will strengthen you although you have not known Me.

22. Turn to Me and be saved, all the ends of the earth, for I am God, and there is no other.
23. By Myself I swore, righteousness emanated from My mouth, a word, and it shall not be retracted, that to Me shall every knee kneel, every tongue shall swear."

I think the above is self explantory although I could go on with much more scripture to show G-D is alone and will not give HIS glory to another and that HE is not a man and does not lie.

I shall come back to this but first I am just answering the questions I put forward.


Who did JC come for Israel or Gentiles?

According to Matthew, JC came for the lost tribe of Israel.
Not so as it does not make any sense why he would arrive in the land of Israel for a people who had been exiled, one need only to look in Kings to see that both Israel and Judah had been exiled and the remnant who remained were under Greek/Roman rule.

Also (I will have to check the passages and chapters) G-D had told Israel well before this time that the prophets would have no more visions and that they had ceased to be sent to Israel. Israel was in exile as promised by G-D.

Is G-DS word pure, refined, intrinsic?
Does G-D change?

G-D'S word never changes and one must understand what his word is saying and follow it to the letter. Therefore how can the NT be correct? Why does G-D need to offer another alternative through a man when HIS word is pure and refined and we are not to add to it nor take away from it? G-D proposed that Israel "who is his servant and firstborn son" would lead all of mankind to HIM, they failed and where exiled for this (they will be redeemed though).

It is and always has been G-D'S will that all mankind should follow the commands of the Torah without adjustment, none whatsoever.

G-D has already given us the path and shown us how to obtain salvation, G-D is unchanging and certainly would not change for the sake of man. It is often stated that the G-D of the OT is a vengeful G-D well not so look at Exodus 34 for his attributes.

Every day we all do not deserve HIS grace/mercy yet fortunately as the Psalms state HE does not pay us according to our sins (as pointed out in Exod 34).Besides me personally as an Israelite have seen nothing good come from JC; I see none of his prophecies have come to pass either.

Anyway I shall go into more detail when I next post and I shall provide some more scripture. For now I leave you with these questions.
Who is G-D's son and who is his servant?
Who created good and evil?

 

Sorry been so busy but will add a little more whenev I can.

I wrote: Also (I will have to check the passages and chapters) G-D had told Israel well before this time that the prophets would have no more visions and that they had ceased to be sent to Israel. Israel was in exile as promised by G-D.

See Psalm 74:9 for a start and IIKings

Also with respect to:

Who is G-D's son and who is his servant?

See Isaiah it tells you several times Israel is his servant, The Psalms also tells you that both Israel and King David are his son. Exodus states "Ephraim is my first born son"

Furthermore G-D told us Israel would go into exile to expiate her sins, as Israel is a light to the nations and decimates G-D's name when she sins. This is exactly what has happened and why the World is in the state it is. The so called messiah never brought a way out, only in YHVH alone is salvation found .

Exodus 32:39 See now that I, I am HE, and no god is with me. I put to death and I bring life...

Who created good and evil?

Certainly not satan (which means adversary) even Satan is subject to G-D and G-D assigns him the tasks (see Job). The answer can be found in Isaiah 45:7 and Lamenations 3:37 and if you look at the whole chapter you will also discover that it is G-D who puts a man though his punishments (retribution) in the first place. The ruler of all things who is Just and does not allow any sin to go unpunished but leviates the suffering with mercy and when the sin is expiated HE pities.

Did christ fulfill the Torah as claimed? Was he a farmer or a judge or all the different peoples to which the commands refer to? No one can fulfill the Torah ever.

Question are these letters from Paul proof that Paul was a liar as he admits to deception?

Corinthians 9:20-22: To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews; to those under the law I became as one under the law -- though not being myself under the law -- that I might win those under the law. To those outside the law I became as one outside the law -- not being without law toward God but under the law of Christ -- that I might win those outside the law. To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak.

Romans 3:7: If through my lies God’s truth abounds to His glory, why am I still being condemned as a sinner?

Philippians 1:18: In every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Jesus is proclaimed, and in that I rejoice.

 

I have been so busy lately,I am involved with rapatriations and trying to set up a child safeguarding project in my city (it is needed).Will be back when I can.

 

When I wrote rapatriations(deh) I mean reparations for those affected by the Atlantic Slave trade (nothing to do with dead bodies)