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It's sad how some men feel women should actually be flattered by dehumanizing behavior. I saw a group of young men yell out to a random woman returning home during the rush hour..."You look sweet, I'll suck you p****!" They clearly did not know her, she was dressed nicely and there were several pedestrians (some with small children) who observed the entire incident.I totally understand these ladies, and they did not say ALL black men, they are talking about the neighborhoods they live in and grew up in and the men who stand around and call out to them. They are not talking about nice, kind, black gentlemen who frequent this board obviously. But that is exactly the kind of thing I have to go through when I take a walk down the street alone in some Mexican border town.
It is true, in my experience that White men don't tend to do the same thing, they are rude in their own way, but more quiet and personal about it. They may call out rude remarks of hatred, but not trying to "hook up" like Mexicans tend too here, and like these ladies sound like they are talking about.
That's not what they said.
Why? Don't you find them at least a little bit attractive. It happens to me all the time, and I don't consider myself attractive.
There is something culturally different in white men, and they don't tend to do that. (I'm not defending what they do, I'm just saying you could make the same documentary here about Hispanic men.)
Many become enraged if women reject that type of disrespect while the men consider themselves complimenting women. I could tell some stories about what I've seen and heard.People have asked me the same thing, and one of the ladies on the video put it well. She basically said, "I'm a professional with a good job, I don't dress or act like a hoe." That's part of the problem, it's embarrassing especially when you are with someone else.
It makes a lady feel like they think she's "easy", it makes one wonder if she dressed inappropriately! That's what I feel like when I get it, and I would NEVER respond kindly to such a thing, it does nothing for me, I ignore it and walk on, because I don't want to be hostile.
This article was done in response to a young woman who was killed (age16) because she did respond negatively to them. These women feel threatened. I have felt threatened in some neighborhoods by this sort of thing.
Also these women are talking about comments regarding their "curves" and it gets old real quick, sometimes you don't know if it's a complement or an insult, it makes you wonder if they would like to have you or if they think you're fat.
I get the impression many of the men do not want the black girls and women to receive respect so they try to encourage all men to dump on them. Some become very hostile when ignored. One guy yelled out "Who these biches think they are! I'm going to get me a white woman fvck these hos." He looked so mean and hateful yet expected a random teen to accept that disgusting and embarassing language as a compliment.I don't know if it was negative as much as informative. When "Sharp Talk with Al Sharpton" was on tv1, I remember this ep. where two black women came on talking about how to attract men. The younger woman made the case like in this doc. that she was "harassed" daily by some random guy who presumably wanted to talk to her. She stated how uneasy she felt about receiving a greeting from a total stranger out on the street even if it appeared innocent. THe other woman was older and argued that it's how women present themselves that affords whatever attention they got.
So I understand both sides. The issues seems to me that there is a general lack of respect for black girls and women in general. Black men, we have been guilty over the years, especially recently, of taking advantage of our own women. We should speak to them better and approach them in a more adult, respectable manner. In defense of brothas in general, those that holla at a girl from a crowd usually do it to play up to his boys. That guy probably might be the quietest of the bunch otherwise. Dudes do egg other dudes on. And sometimes brothas don't come correctly at a girl 'cause if she fine, he might think she'll act uppity like a gurly he got dissed by in a club or something. Some black girls are a little nasty when a regular brotha tries to come at 'em and talk to 'em. So there are a lot of factors at work.
So for black girls reading and friends of sistahs, have respect for yourself first. Hold your head up high with pride. And if a brotha comes at you wrong on the street, stop and correct him right on the spot in a respectful, lady-like fashion. You have the power ladies. We're after YOU of course. And, as men, we'll swallow our pride and listen. But be real. NO decent looking sistah can walk down ANY block and not be hollered at.
And therein lies the difference. I've seen teenaged boys in the presence of other non-black teens harrass even older black women who were merely walking trying to get to their jobs. This is why I believe they want other men to join in knowing the women have no support. It's a major problem that some folks are attempting to trivialize. While observing that teen I thought he had better sense than to do the same to non-black women.I got more crap in Oakland than in San Francisco, but it never came close to the crap the black women got in Oakland. There is still some stigma in harassing white women because the police will take our word most times.
I do agree that poorer neighborhoods are worse off.
It's clear that some women do not believe we are all equal and deserve the same level of respect.You probably aren't bothered by this rude behavior because as you stated, sometimes it's an "ego" boost for you. I is not an ego boost for me ever. And I am absolutely relieved when it doesn't happen, or when I'm in DC for instance, and people tend to mind their own business and it is a rare occasion, here it's common and bothersome.
It makes a lady feel filthy, it has nothing to do with complaining, I have mentioned it here on the board because I wanted to figure out what if anything I may be able to do about it, but as best I can tell, the only thing would be to move, and that is not an option at this point. I don't let it impact my life, accept that I prefer to drive, even small distances to avoid such behavior if possible, but it is a real problem for some women and it cannot be excused, because some women think it's not a problem. It someone doesn't like a sexual advance and they way it is being made, it can be considered sexual harassment or worse, even outside the work place.
What's even sadder is other men will not speak out on this problem and actually delight in knowing their own women are being debased and harrassed. This is why many women do not make eye contact in passing. You have to question what do they have to gain encouraging disrespect for women just because of the color of their skin.That is what our society has come to and it is very very sad that it happens.
It's unfortunately if it's unnerving to you that all white women do not despise black people as a "whole". Just and fair treatment shouldn't end with black/white men exclusively. Little do you know the respect that you crave will not be achieved by encouraging everyone around you to trample on black women and their children by extension which includes you as well. You want to be viewed as an "individual" just like everyone else to level the playing the field so you may as well understand raw hatred has no place in today's society. I was born white and will remain so but don't feel I have to despise black women to bond with black men. Plus I do not date black men exclusively as many women on the board. Now that some of you believe European and Asian women are superior to white Americans it's just a matter of time before we are on the receiving end of the same treatment you reserve for black women. It seems some of you relish the idea of women at loggerheads over you. This devisiveness needs to stop!porcelain sword could you please describe yourself, are you white? black? male? female? and what your doing on here? Im getting a picture of you but the picture I have is one that is passively anti bm, and definitely not pro-IR involving black men. If Im wrong please set me straight. Dont forget to answer the initial questions first.
Thanks in advance.
Okay, possibly that last post didn't express enough.
It seems to me that black men find themselves in much the same dynamic with black women as white women found themselves with white men a few decades ago.
From the dawn of the feminist movement, even dating back to suffragette days, black women were excluded. Today, many revisionists claim this was because black women chose to put black rights before women's rights, but the truth is that black women were excluded by white women from the very beginning.
Over time, however, as women gained more equality, the results were gradually shared with all first world women, including black women. Having not been included in the struggle, however, black women had not internalized any of the philosophies -- equal rights, equal responsibilities, etc. Black women, who had always had to work even when many white women did not, are thus now immersed in two very conflicting ideologies: seeking out a man to take care of them, to be the provider & protector, while simultaneously pursuing an independent lifestyle.
They are brought up to desire both equal treatment and special treatment.
Compounding this confusion are the dregs of institutionalized racism, which encourages the hiring and promoting of "twofers" (as racists have so charmingly dubbed those with two types of minority status), particularly black women who are seen as less threatening to many of those white people who still harbor racism. At the lower end of the class spectrum, the same gender inequality occurs as the result of outdated social services that deny support to any family with a man in the home.
The result of all this is a situation where the power dynamic in the black community substantially favors black women. This is no better than a community where the power dynamic substantially favors men. Without equality, someone is getting screwed, it is the nature of the game.
You can see parallels between the white male/white female dynamic of years past and the black female/ black male dynamic today in many areas.
For instance, abuse & police. In a dispute between a white man and a white woman, police have historically sympathized with the white man regardless of the existing situation. Likewise, in a dispute between a black man and a black woman, the police tend to sympathize with the black woman regardless of the existing situation.
In generations past, if a white man felt that his wife was being unfaithful (often unjustifiably), he might feel free to storm through the house destroying those things precious to her, and attempt to intimidate her through force as a means of "teach her a lesson." If the wife called the police, those officers would more often than not side with the husband, refuse to report the crime, and might even assist in the lesson-teaching.
Similarly, in a situation becoming ever more common, if a black woman suspects that her significant other has been unfaithful (often unjustifiably), she might feel free to storm through the house destroying those things precious to him in an attempt to intimidate him through force as a means of "teaching him a lesson." Not only will police be unlike to side with a black man in this case should he call, but many black women have taken to calling the police themselves in disputes where they are the agressor. Because the physical power of women is often less than men, in the current power dynamic between black men and black women, black women frequently use surrogates such as the police to commit abuse against black men. This may take the form of calling police for false reasons (often resulting in police brutality), or using friends and family to attack the black man.
As a white woman who is deeply grateful for the rights I have today thanks to my mother's generation, and my grandmother's generation, and her grandmother's generation, I do consider it my responsibility to support others who seek equality.
It is tempting, as a woman, to automatically side with women in every power struggle or dispute. This however makes for very shallow and inconsistent ideals. While it is true that historically and globally, women have been oppressed by men because of size differences we are no longer living in a society where size alone can determine one's relative power to the opposite gender. With black women currently holding the greatest amount of power between the genders in the black community, and currently being described as the leaders of that community, it is shortsighted to assume that those interested in gender equality and fairness should side with black women by default.
It is important to note that speaking out about inequality is not divisive. Speaking out about black women's continual degradation of black men is no more divisive than objecting to Rush Limbaugh's constant yammering about "feminazis".
It is divisive, however, to make up stories as a lame attempt to justify racist and outdated mythologies about interracial couples, on a board designed to celebrate such couples.
BTW... I do not, for a second, believe you are who you say you are and I think your username would be better suited for racist site.
It's unfortunately if it's unnerving to you that all white women do not despise black people as a "whole". Just and fair treatment shouldn't end with black/white men exclusively. Little do you know the respect that you crave will not be achieved by encouraging everyone around you to trample on black women and their children by extension which includes you as well. You want to be viewed as an "individual" just like everyone else to level the playing the field so you may as well understand raw hatred has no place in today's society. I was born white and will remain so but don't feel I have to despise black women to bond with black men. Plus I do not date black men exclusively as many women on the board. Now that some of you believe European and Asian women are superior to white Americans it's just a matter of time before we are on the receiving end of the same treatment you reserve for black women. It seems some of you relish the idea of women at loggerheads over you. This devisiveness needs to stop!
A racist lesbian/feminist, please take your anti bm ass back to racist site.
She's a bitter BW from Blackvoices.A racist lesbian/feminist, please take your anti bm ass back to racist site.
Okay, possibly that last post didn't express enough.
It seems to me that black men find themselves in much the same dynamic with black women as white women found themselves with white men a few decades ago.
From the dawn of the feminist movement, even dating back to suffragette days, black women were excluded. Today, many revisionists claim this was because black women chose to put black rights before women's rights, but the truth is that black women were excluded by white women from the very beginning.
Over time, however, as women gained more equality, the results were gradually shared with all first world women, including black women. Having not been included in the struggle, however, black women had not internalized any of the philosophies -- equal rights, equal responsibilities, etc. Black women, who had always had to work even when many white women did not, are thus now immersed in two very conflicting ideologies: seeking out a man to take care of them, to be the provider & protector, while simultaneously pursuing an independent lifestyle.
They are brought up to desire both equal treatment and special treatment.
Compounding this confusion are the dregs of institutionalized racism, which encourages the hiring and promoting of "twofers" (as racists have so charmingly dubbed those with two types of minority status), particularly black women who are seen as less threatening to many of those white people who still harbor racism. At the lower end of the class spectrum, the same gender inequality occurs as the result of outdated social services that deny support to any family with a man in the home.
The result of all this is a situation where the power dynamic in the black community substantially favors black women. This is no better than a community where the power dynamic substantially favors men. Without equality, someone is getting screwed, it is the nature of the game.
You can see parallels between the white male/white female dynamic of years past and the black female/ black male dynamic today in many areas.
For instance, abuse & police. In a dispute between a white man and a white woman, police have historically sympathized with the white man regardless of the existing situation. Likewise, in a dispute between a black man and a black woman, the police tend to sympathize with the black woman regardless of the existing situation.
In generations past, if a white man felt that his wife was being unfaithful (often unjustifiably), he might feel free to storm through the house destroying those things precious to her, and attempt to intimidate her through force as a means of "teach her a lesson." If the wife called the police, those officers would more often than not side with the husband, refuse to report the crime, and might even assist in the lesson-teaching.
Similarly, in a situation becoming ever more common, if a black woman suspects that her significant other has been unfaithful (often unjustifiably), she might feel free to storm through the house destroying those things precious to him in an attempt to intimidate him through force as a means of "teaching him a lesson." Not only will police be unlike to side with a black man in this case should he call, but many black women have taken to calling the police themselves in disputes where they are the agressor. Because the physical power of women is often less than men, in the current power dynamic between black men and black women, black women frequently use surrogates such as the police to commit abuse against black men. This may take the form of calling police for false reasons (often resulting in police brutality), or using friends and family to attack the black man.
As a white woman who is deeply grateful for the rights I have today thanks to my mother's generation, and my grandmother's generation, and her grandmother's generation, I do consider it my responsibility to support others who seek equality.
It is tempting, as a woman, to automatically side with women in every power struggle or dispute. This however makes for very shallow and inconsistent ideals. While it is true that historically and globally, women have been oppressed by men because of size differences we are no longer living in a society where size alone can determine one's relative power to the opposite gender. With black women currently holding the greatest amount of power between the genders in the black community, and currently being described as the leaders of that community, it is shortsighted to assume that those interested in gender equality and fairness should side with black women by default.
It is important to note that speaking out about inequality is not divisive. Speaking out about black women's continual degradation of black men is no more divisive than objecting to Rush Limbaugh's constant yammering about "feminazis".
It is divisive, however, to make up stories as a lame attempt to justify racist and outdated mythologies about interracial couples, on a board designed to celebrate such couples.
BTW... I do not, for a second, believe you are who you say you are and I think your username would be better suited for racist site.
She's a bitter BW from Blackvoices.
They hate Brothers over there
