education reform: what would you do if you were president

Decent post. Where did you go to hs?

 

Brooklyn Tech

 

what are you majoring in ?

 

Oh yeah that was up there with Bronx Science. Good school. Too bad more districts don't follow their lead and do specialized hs. The one size fits all approach ain't cutting it.

 

It was a good school, but even that wasn't challenging. I think the concept of having majors are important. The other issue that needs to be tackled is the fact that a lot of colleges are money mills where your degree is worthless. A lot of majors are also worthless from a practical POV (sociology, philosophy, history...); this issue also needs to be tackled.

I was an Electrical Engineering major in HS- shows you that an inner city kid can do pretty damn well with a bit of guidance.

Edit: I also disagree with Obama's plan of "empowering" community colleges. Community colleges are where kids who have been failed by the system/or themselves go to waste their time and learn to add 1+1. The funding should be directed towards high school.

 

If you mean on people that aren't going to succeed, of course it is important that the investments are made wisely. You simplify it too much.

- You meet the qualifying criteria, which should be to a high standard that provides different paths of entry for those with a range of circumstances.
- The government takes care of your tuitition, or provides a no interest long term loan (in Australia, you repay that with your taxes)
- If you don't make satisfactory academic progress, you're out.
- Repeat.

This is the same strategy used very successfully in the UK previously, and some universities remain amongst the highest quality in the world.

Assisting citizens, even by increasing taxes does not make a communist country. Look at Sweden and other Nordic countries- they have of the best life indicators in the entire world (standard of education, literacy, life expectancy, infant mortality and other standard quality of life indicators) with higher taxes and greater government contribution to education.

We will never agree though, because clearly you view taxes as some type of punishment or payment that should be dished straight back to you.

I view them as a measure of what you can afford to contribute to society, and I would have real reason to complain if I wanted because in Australia my income is taxed at $17,580 plus another $1 for every dollar over $80,000 which is quite a lot. And I damn glad that someone else's taxes, when I was coming out of high school as an 'average citizen' could help me get the education to earn that salary- and it was still fucking hard with all the books and other expenses besides.

 

Of course, you are right on the first point but education doesn't have to be university based. There are millions of other things like vocational based, apprenticeships etc as I think Mr Fantastic mentioned. I'm not just talking about universities.

Whilst it is possible, the second point is a capitalist fairytale. It's possible in some cases, but not 'extremely easy' or everyone would be there dawg that's how your emphasis on a stratified society that you were harping on about earlier works. You can work damn hard and still be poor despite your abilities, that's why they call them the 'working poor'. You just saw it with your own eyes during the GFC and you still make that point?

Augh.. ok my fun is over.. bored of this now :smt069

 

! Many successful people are smart but many "unsuccessful" people are too.

 

Yeah, the most intelligent person i know is driving a truck for coke cause he never could figure out what he wanted to do. Damn white people.

 

Both of my parents has a job that people would definitively say you need to be 'smart' for or whatever fucking else. But when my Mum came here as an 18 year old refugee with my grandparents she couldn't get any job at all because there was a prejudice against European people with olive skin.

My Grandmother (French teacher) and my Grandfather (engineer) couldn't get jobs either. And it still happens today. It took my grandpa 8 years to save up the money to go to University here to get his qualifications changed over, etc etc.

Lots of different life circumstances prevent people 'succeeding' in the way society measures it,they could have easily given up. Many people are driven to drink, drugs, suicide, depression and then crime etc. I see it every damn day with my clients and for many I'd never be so disrespectful to say it was because they were dumb.

 

Part of the problem is money too (especially for college). My family doesn't have enough, that's why I had to settle for CC. Afterwards, I could get a scholarship based on my program of study and graduate with little to no debt. Something should really be done to lower college tuition rates.

 

It was pretty easy for me to get financial aid as a minority; especially if you are a decent or above average student. Probably one of the advantages we have.

 

there is nothing wrong with Community colleges. it is a good place to start off. sometimes you dont need more than that to be successful

 

I question this comment. Many states give some kind of scholarship that allows you to go to school for free. Is it really that bad in the north that the north states are unable to give scholarships for their student to go to universities and college for free?

 

I completely disagree with your view on community college. Cc is a great way for people who aren't ready for 4 year schools to transition from hs to a more vigorous program. It also allows someone the opportunity to change their lives who has the desire to change fields. Both my parents and my older brother are immigrants from Jamaica who went to community college and then went on to four year schools. My brother got two masters in electrical and computer engineering and it wouldn't have been possible without community college.

 

No, it's not.

Not too many people went to CCs when I was in college because of the stigma attached to it, either. I'm sure it must be different now, considering the economy, but I knew plenty of people who found money for school just to avoid going to a community college. Many of them even took out loans in their own names to avoid it if they couldn't get enough in scholarships to cover it. It's not impossible to get funding.

 

Well its easier for people to convince themselves its the fault of the poor and under educated for being lazy than it is to acknowledge that the system is flawed and biased because that might require them to actually do something.

 

Cosign. Its the lie that cc is the 13th and 14th grade and any four year school no matter the major is just better. If you go to a cc you'll end up fat and balding.

 

I agree with you. Some family members and friends started off at CC and went on to major universities. Definitely great preparation for a 4 year.

 

If a community college is 'vigorous' then Mother Theresa was a cougar.

No, but seriously, it depends on the program and the school- as with any situation... it works for SOME people, but you have to have the maturity to make it work for you. A lot of people who transfer from a CC to a 4 year don't do as well because they don't have the same worth ethic or maturity as those already there in their junior year. Nevermind that they also are outsiders to the established students, and they're experiencing things that those juniors went through two years previous as they adjusting to life at a four year.

I think that sending a kid to a community college as an 'easy road' does them a great disservice. It should be the last option to consider- not the first, especially if they have the ability to flourish in a four year right off the bat.