I Had a Racial, Wake-Up Call Yesterday

It is often said that there's always a time when those of us who haven't had the best experiences in our attempts at dating women of our own race here in America, will come across a racial experience that will serve as some sort of wake-up call when we try to approach and make advances on white women. I think mine happened yesterday while waiting for my late evening train as usual, to return home. I was sitting next to a white woman possibly in her late 30s who I found quite attractive and I tried to look for a way to start a conversation with her.


I thought the easiest way for me to do so would be to compliment her on her leather shoes, so I said "Hi lady, I really like your shoes." Not only did she completely ignore me and keep on reading her newspaper, avoiding all form of eye contact (which I have no problem with, since I'm a stranger to her) but she was suddenly overtaken by an amazing sense of panic that led her to quickly rearrange her luggage, grab her stuff, and walk away from me as fast as possible. She then stood in line with a group of other passengers and waited to catch her train.


Now, I have no problem with being ignored, as it is part of the dating game and a significant part of life, but in this woman's non-verbal communication and the rapidity with which she left the bench where she was seated next to me just within a few moments after I spoke to her, I not only clearly saw her "fear" of me as a black male, but also an arrogance and pride that accompanied her snubbing, the kind of reaction you get from someone who thinks you're not on her level, not her equal.


It was a very painful experience and I felt very humiliated, but I have been through very many painful experiences in most of my dating experiences, so it didn't take me too long to get over it. It was just a few weeks ago that an old white couple, upon seeing me walking toward their car, quickly pressed down the buttons of their car locks as if I may have been planning to carjack them.


Yesterday's experience has now led me to decide that from now henceforth, if any woman, regardless of nationality or race, should happen to express a genuine interest in me, I will accept her. It clearly showed me that in as much as we would like to persuade ourselves that things have changed, racism is still very much alive in America and interracial dating between black males and white women is still not considered normal or approved for the most part. While things may be changing and society is making progress, the fact is that most white Americans, (men and women included) aside from those on forums such as these and other good-natured people do not like us black men and do not consider us their equals. They would rather have someone else of any other nationality (excluding Africans) get married to their daughters.



So from now on, a new philosophy will guide me. If I have to approach a white woman, I will be prepared for the possibility that she may be prejudiced against me and may show that prejudice to me openly in ways that may embarrass and humiliate me. It is a risk that I will have to be prepared for. I remember the words of one of my white male friends who said to me two years ago: "Dude, you're black. It's still a big deal in the United States." It is and it always will be.



So to my fellow brothers in here, in as much as some of us including myself may not have had the best experiences trying to date intra-racially here in America and have consequently developed a preference for women of other races, let us never forget those who fought for our rights throughout history so that we could eat in the same restaurants, sit in the same buses (and not at the back of the bus) and even consider dating white American women, quite a few of who may not even be taking us very seriously nor see us as longterm partners. Let us always remember Africa, my continent and the continent from which your ancestors came, which continues to suffer from the influence of neocolonialism and the effects of colonial masters who partitioned it, separating people from their brothers for selfish purposes. That is the world in which we live. As unfair and sad as it is, we as black men, need to unite with each other and continue to keep our heads up in spite of everything that is working against us. You all take care.

 

I just think you ran into someone with a predisposition to your character or culture rather. There's still plenty of WW that don't mind reciprocating friendly conversation with BM.

Of course there's always a spoiled one in the bunch; it's inevitable. If that woman was black or latin, you may not have felt so bad but because she wasn't it made an even greater impact.

 

let me be the first to say how sorry that this female acted so rudely.. and that i hope u in no way give up on all the other wf's in the world ...and good luck in findin the right one for u

 

yeah it is really a bad representation of us and i hope you dont give up on ww!!

 

ALWAYS feel her out first

When you're looking to approach a white woman ALWAYS feel her out first man. You'll know if she's comfortable around us or not. Watch her body language and if she gives off positive energy. Eye contact is key too and not just a passing glance but if she invites you with her eyes you're cool. If she doesn't seem inviting then leave her alone no matter how fine she is. That'll save you alot more than a hurt ego...

Peace!

 

Re: ALWAYS feel her out first

I agree with Rakim's suggestion, Shaft.

If I am in a public situation and I can "sense" that a man is checking me out, looking to talk to me, etc. and I know I am not interested, I will show it with my body language and completely avoiding all eye contact. This is usually enough to discourage them from talking to me.

Also, I understand from your post that you took this situation to heart and have made some very serious decisions because of it. I encourage you though to take a step back for a moment...and think about the situation. For all you know, this woman could have good reason to have acted the way she did. Perhaps she was once sexually assaulted, or had a bad experience with a man on a train. Maybe at one time she had a controlling husband/boyfriend and is now leary of men making advances towards her. Maybe she has some kind of social or anxiety disorder. WHO KNOWS?! The fact is, her reaction more than likely had a little something to do with her and may not have been entirely about you.

Don't let one bad seed ruin the whole bunch....this woman's behavior was not a representation of all WW, nor WW attitudes in general. Take it with a grain of salt!

 

I really don't want you to think I have it out for you Shaft but I don't understand why every interaction with women you post about here comes down to race and/ or implied racism. While I think that particular shoe lady could have let you down more easy why do you automatically assume it has to do with race?
Please allow me to be a hobby psychologist here but could it be that you are actually not comfortable/ confident to deal with white women or that preference that you think you have for white women? Or let me ask you when a black woman let's you down what do make of that?

Again I don't want to instigate I just don't understand

 

well, next time give her a chance to even notice you before you suprise her with a personal comment, You could have started with a general, less captious question, such as "Excuse me, can you tell me what time the train will arrive?", or "Excuse me, I have to go to xy location, is this is the right train?" or something like this. This would have given her the chance to realize that you are there and it would have given you the chance to check out if she is signaling that it's okay to further approach her.

Another thing: You are out there hunting for women as if your life depends on it (what happend to the one you were planning to have sex with? Or the one in the gym? or the girl in your class?) Women are able to sense this, you know?

 

While some of what Shaft says here may be true about racism being alive and well in the US... it is unfortunate that this whole reflexion comes from ONE White Woman not appreciating an unwelcome advance!

But whatever.... People have given this guy loads of golden advice on this board but it would appear that he has no interest in listening since he keeps coming back here to whine about his lack of success with women.

It's too bad though... you would think that when a bunch of women are essentially saying the same thing that they might be worth listening to! :roll:

I thought that Albert Einstein's definition of insanity might fit in well here:
"Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."


:smt061

 

It doesn't seem worthwhile to take such a reaction so personally, when it may have more to do with her than you, whether or not it was a racial reason as to why she reacted that way, and if that was the case, then welcome to the club, though you won't get that type of reaction from every single white women you meet and greet, so don't shortchange yourself thinking that...

and, uh..... Shaft, YOU LIVE IN PHILADELPHIA...

so, maybe you should consider relocating FIRST before giving up on white women altogether.



And, Slivercosma, Chigirl, and PearlGirl, you're NOT Americans, so most of what he says doesn't apply to either of you. Don't take him so seriously. I'm sure he means well.

 

Re: To Pearl Girl and Others

Pearl Girl Wrote:

"While some of what Shaft says here may be true about racism being alive and well in the US... it is unfortunate that this whole reflexion comes from ONE White Woman not appreciating an unwelcome advance!

But whatever.... People have given this guy loads of golden advice on this board but it would appear that he has no interest in listening since he keeps coming back here to whine about his lack of success with women."


Pearl Girl, I don't appreciate what you wrote above. Don't let my posts give you a reason to attempt painting me as some unfortunate loser who just never has any luck with women no matter what the case may be. Your choice of words, "unwelcome advance," "whine about his lack of success with women" gives me that impression and really pisses me off. I don't appreciate it. Stop it. Don'ttake it personal with me.


To those of you who asked about the first woman I met at my gym whose best friend actually once went out with my older brother...things didn't work out the way I would have hoped. The last time I saw her, on our third date, things seemed to be going pretty well at least as far as I could tell. We were holding hands when I was walking her to her car and we kissed before we separated. But then the next time I called her, she told me how "busy" she's going to be in the next several weeks with her best friend getting married this month, upcoming Jewish holidays and her vacation in mid-October. That seemed clear enough to me and I decided to give her her space...I haven't been in touch with her since then.


As far as the second woman at my gym who I was hoping to get a chance to introduce myself to, I never saw her again and in terms of the one in my class, she still gives me the sideways glances from time to time and looks at me in class, but I haven't approached her.


For some people, and I guess that may be the case for me, maybe it takes a while to eventually find love. It may involve lots of stumbling and falling and heart breaking experiences, but in the end, I do hope and maintain the confidence that there might be someone special out there for me.


I think it would be healthy for me at this point to take a break from trying to date anyone for a while and just focus on getting my Master's degree in May and also take a break from this forum for a while. Responses such as those written by Pearl Girl are just not the kind of stuff I want to be reading at this time in my life.

 

An Additional Thought

On second thought, I think much of this is an American woman thing...because I haven't had to deal with a lot of this with women from other countries. I'm not saying that all American women are like this but it's only here in this country that I met a woman once who said to me: "I have never before met a man who treats a woman as well as you do. I need to find myself." It's pretty much here in America that many women would say they want a "good man" or a so-called "nice guy" but when he does actually come along, they get confused. They run back to the men who abuse them and insult them and humiliate them, beat them up and curse them out. It may be that American women and I just don't fit.

 

Re: An Additional Thought

That's what we've been TRYING to tell ya, man! :lol:

 

Shaft, my man, i always appreciate the fact that you pull no punches with your posts but i think you are just getting it mixed up here. In truth, we (and i mean those of us who have our dating verizon wide open) often run into people who throw things in our faces but my man, can you not ignore such people and put them where they belong?

I do understand the fact that you've had your ego brushed aside by this woman but for all we know, it could be nothing to do with your skin color? Now do not get me wrong; i am not advocating that she did not do it because you're black or anything but given the scenario, i will not be too quick to jump to such conclusions. It could have been that she did not like to speak with people she is not familiar with. I do not want to go into depths about the various reasons she might have done that, racism included by the way, but i feel you have over-estimated the depth of her flippant caprice.

Indeed, there are some white women who act like that towards men in general, let alone black males, but the exact same thing could be said about other ethnicities of women. There are women who want to be treated like goddesses (all women to some extent 8) ) and they would act like they are the best thing to happen to human beings since sliced bread but that is just how some women are. It is really nothing to get worked up over because it is going to happen all over again if you really are interested in dating. You cannot relinquish all dating options because of the not-so-flattering behavior of ONE woman. So what happens when a woman actually says something? You are not going to slit your wrists, are you?

I know this is hard to cope with but you've gotta let it burn, dawg. Those things happen all the time and if she indeed were turned off by your skin color, woe betide her then. Certain things you just have to get used to in America. I am no longer offended when people lock up their cars, wind up their windows and clutch their purses upon seeing me. What i cannot fight against, i ignore. I will not have some imbecile follow me around in a store thinking i want to steal something. Now that is something i can fight against and i do when the opportunity arises.

I do not really think anyone here disagrees that racism is part of American life and no one here is immune from its unjustifiable and rationally inexplicable realms but you've got to get used to it. As for IR dating not being accepted by people, well i have always mentioned that i do not have to be accepted by others to make myself happy. I do not need to approval of any asswipe to please myself because my self-concept is very high and i do whatever the hell i damn please.

How glad i'd be if you and pretty much any black man adopted a similar stance!!!

 

well you had my sympathy and understanding until you got on the American woman thing..

 

Shaft, I'm giving my two cents..and I'm not being mean, and I understand that what happened hurt you.

But, WAH WAH WAH. A white girl ignored me while waiting for the train and walked away. I'm SO upset. C'mon dawg, get over that. Why are you talking to girls on the train anyway?

I take the commuter rail from Boston back to the suburbs everyday. Do you know how many white women LOATHE to sit next to me, hoping that I don't sit next to them? Do you know how many pull their bags as soon as they see me? Money, it's not the people but the setting. You picked the wrong setting, and quite honestly, ya should have known better.

Check this out, you meet nice white women from a friend, or school or work, even from the club or the bar.

You don't meet white women on a train. Hell, you don't meet any women from a train. Of course there are exceptions, but it's usually all bad. People are just trying to go home or to work. That's where you messed up.

Now if your are talking Amtrak or flying, yeah you may have a shot.

Shaft, blow this shit off, it's no big deal. Chalk it up as a learning experience and move on.

BT

 

Re: To Pearl Girl and Others

Shaft, before you go, i just want to let you know that if i could find somebody special for me, i KNOW for a fact that you can find the same thing. I know that it's cliche and all, but you will find that person when you least expect it, and when it happens it's almost going to seem surreal. But i mean, with your posts, i take it like you wouldn't be posting these things, asking for advice, if you didn't value our opinions, but like everybody has said, you can't let one ww change the way you think about them. I know i for one, really hate it when some random black guy does something really stupid like rob someone, and people start looking at me like i'm going to do the same stupid thing that he did. I'm not like that, i would never rob or hurt anybody, and so there are plenty of ww out there who won't be scared off by you, and who will actually embrace your presence. One of the hardest things to do in the world is to avoid generalizing, because humans tend to have a weird, natural tendency to want to do that for whatever reason, but you have to try, because if you don't, you're gonna miss out on a lot of great opportunities with a lot of really great people you know.

 

Response to Bryant and Black Tiger

Bryant, thanks so much for your kind words. I truly appreciate it. Black Tiger, you suggested that perhaps I would have had a different experience with this woman if she were getting on an Amtrak train rather than a regular regional train to go home. Well, she was about to catch an Amtrak train. The station where I catch the train to go home services both regional routes and Amtrak routes. Honestly, I'm way over that experience I had right now and I'm moving on. It's been nice communicating with you folks within this short period of time and I wish everyone the best.

 

Hey Shaft,
In addition to what Bryant and BlackTiger said, this world is too big and there are too many millions of women in this world to get worked up over how just one treated you. A lot of guys underestimate just how we, as men, have the advantage simply because women outnumber us by the millions. Dude, there are about 10 women for every one man (that number might be slightly higher now since it's 2006). But BlackTiger made a crucial point about it being in the right setting.....

My rule of thumb is if a girl gives me positive body language, then AND ONLY THEN, do I make a move, regardless of the setting.

 

Hey Shaft man it's like I said a couple of times on here before.

It is a BITCH! to be single. And thats all I think it is. It is just so hard to read a person now days.