KID ROCK versus the NAACP

Only a damn simple minded trust fund baby would buy into all the bullshit that has been built out over the decades to legitimize the Confederate Flag as not being a racist symbol. Oh wait....the little Black boy in White face is a trust fund baby....
 
Eye of Ra said:
Only a damn simple minded trust fund baby would buy into all the bullshit that has been built out over the decades to legitimize the Confederate Flag as not being a racist symbol. Oh wait....the little Black boy in White face is a trust fund baby....
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Gonna have to get you again huh?


Trust funds have nothing to do with this argument. But while you're talking about random things, I just ate Mcdonalds. You wanna somehow bring that into this argument?

Anyway back to the topic on hand.......





The Swastika was originally a sacred symbol in India for Hinduism.

Now if a bald headed guy with boots walked around with a Swastika sign on his shirt does it mean he practices Hinduism or does it mean he's racist?

It means racist, and do you know why? Because the meaning and use of the Swastika has changed.



Now if the meaning of the Swastika which was around over 1000 years before Hitler was born, can be altered and changed.
Then surely the meaning of the mere 200 year old Confederate Flag can change.

When you look at the bald guy and say "he's not Hindu, he's racist". You're implying that he's using the symbol in it's new meaning and not it's original.

Now maybe...just maybe Kid Rock is also using the Confederate Flag in it's new meaning and not it's original.


Simply put, calling Kid Rock a racist is like saying Hitler wasn't racist, he was just Hindu.


Come on...you've got to be smarter then that.

Try again.



P.S-This is the part where you realize you've lost the argument and you decide to just start throwing out random things.

Like I said I just ate Mcdonalds, that's something random you can talk about.:smt043
 
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Nico said:
Pushing luck? I was "attacked" by those guys because I said the Confederate flag doesn't make one racist.

Now that there's blatant proof right here in front of us......none of them have anything to say.
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I don't care about this topic and for the sake of argument I could make one for your side.

The fact kid rock did this doesn't mean is he racist, correct! But I wouldn't use his association with Black people to make the point that he isn't. The meaning of the flag in of itself is another debate and just because kid rock or your friends at school who displayed the flag were not racist, doesn't mean the flag doesn't hold racist implications.

The only thing I have to say to you, is that given your rep, why are you even going there? Is this such a big issue that you are willing to bring more heat on your ass? Maybe you like it, but I would start making better arguments if that's the case.
 
Nico said:
Gonna have to get you again huh?


Trust funds have nothing to do with this argument. But while you're talking about random things, I just ate Mcdonalds. You wanna somehow bring that into this argument?

Anyway back to the topic on hand.......





The Swastika was originally a sacred symbol in India for Hinduism.

Now if a bald headed guy with boots walked around with a Swastika sign on his shirt does it mean he practices Hinduism or does it mean he's racist?

It means racist, and do you know why? Because the meaning and use of the Swastika has changed.



Now if the meaning of the Swastika which was around over 1000 years before Hitler was born, can be altered and changed.
Then surely the meaning of the mere 200 year old Confederate Flag can change.

When you look at the bald guy and say "he's not Hindu, he's racist". You're implying that he's using the symbol in it's new meaning and not it's original.

Now maybe...just maybe Kid Rock is also using the Confederate Flag in it's new meaning and not it's original.


Simply put, calling Kid Rock a racist is like saying Hitler wasn't racist, he was just Hindu.


Come on...you've got to be smarter then that.

Try again.



P.S-This is the part where you realize you've lost the argument and you decide to just start throwing out random things.

Like I said I just ate Mcdonalds, that's something random you can talk about.:smt043
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Hey genius, I already said the first time we talked about the Confederate Flag in the other thread that not every White person who reps it is racist. So why are you still playing with that tired argument? Believe what ever you want about the Confederate Flag. It's still a racist symbol. The majority of idiots who rep the son of a bitch are mostly ignorant and racist. Sorry, but you didn't get at me. Get your weight up, son. You're lightweight compared to most of dudes I deal with on a daily basis.
 
Eye of Ra said:
Hey genius, I already said the first time we talked about the Confederate Flag in the other thread that not every White person who reps it is racist. So why are you still playing with that tired argument? Believe what ever you want about the Confederate Flag. It's still a racist symbol. The majority of idiots who rep the son of a bitch are mostly ignorant and racist. Sorry, but you didn't get at me. Get your weight up, son. You're lightweight compared to most of dudes I deal with on a daily basis.
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The end.
 
xoxo said:
Ok, now you are working with something here. What's the new meaning?
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The new meaning is stripped of it's racist views and is strictly about Southern Pride. Do some people still use it to show racism? Yes, but not everyone.

Like I said if you wanna ignore that and say that Kid Rock is racist.

Then you also have to ignore the bald guy and say that he's not racist, he's Hindu.


I don't see any holes is what I just said. If you do, please point them out.
 
Nico said:
The new meaning is stripped of it's racist views and is strictly about Southern Pride. Do some people still use it to show racism? Yes, but not everyone.

Like I said if you wanna ignore that and say that Kid Rock is racist.

Then you also have to ignore the bald guy and say that he's not racist, he's Hindu.


I don't see any holes is what I just said. If you do, please point them out.
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Now you're speaking in semantics.

We (us U.S posters) all know what that flag represents. That and the Nazi flag. I don't know of any good connotation associated with it, regardless of someones personal beliefs or motives. As a whole, it represents a horrid past.
 
Nico said:
The new meaning is stripped of it's racist views and is strictly about Southern Pride. Do some people still use it to show racism? Yes, but not everyone.

Like I said if you wanna ignore that and say that Kid Rock is racist.

Then you also have to ignore the bald guy and say that he's not racist, he's Hindu.
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I'm willing to follow along with this, bring some more supporting evidence. I think the fact that Kid Rock and Black rappers using it, whether in ignorance, or with regards to it's new significance, is supporting evidence.

There is a distinctive southern culture, Black and Whites are apart of it for better or worse. Does this mean I think the flag has been refined? No. I think many Black people have a negative reaction to the sight of the thing.

This could be changing though, I wouldn't be surprised in the future if the connotation changed, that it would represent a more universal symbol of southern culture.
 
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Eye of Ra said:
Damn. You seriously just like playing at being ignorant, just to fuck with people, don't you? You're not fun anymore dude. :smt108
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I'm just trying to understand this. Cause in my history books the originally meaning of the Swastika was of Hinduism.

Yet we call people racist for displaying a Swastika flag.


So it's ok to change the meaning of a Swastika to something negative.....but it's not ok to change the meaning of The Confederate Flag to something non-negative?

Just confused by this, please clear it up for me.
 
Inner Beauty said:
Now you're speaking in semantics.

We (us U.S posters) all know what that flag represents. That and the Nazi flag. I don't know of any good connotation associated with it, regardless of someones personal beliefs or motives. As a whole, it represents a horrid past.
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Let's not compare it with the nazi flag, which is more charged. No performer would think about wearing it on stage, no one is that bold or ignorant. Let's not bring up an ADL vs NAACP argument either, or who goes harder against such things. The Nazi Flag is much more charged with negativity than the confederate flag, for many reasons.
 
xoxo said:
I'm willing to follow along with this, bring some more supporting evidence. I think the fact that Kid Rock and Black rappers using it, whether in ignorance, or with the regards to it's new significance, is supporting evidence.

There is a distinctive southern culture, Black and Whites are apart of it for better or worse. Does this mean I think the flag has been refined? No. I think many Black people have a negative reaction to the sight of the thing.

This could be changing though, I wouldn't be surprised in the future if the connotation changed, that it would represent a more universal symbol of southern culture.
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Ah someone with a brain around here.

Well the way I see it, some white still have a negative reaction to black people or...... interracial couples?;) Doesn't mean they're right though.

I don't see whats hard for people to understand about this. It's a case of "Some not all"
Is the confederate flag a sign of racism? Sometimes not all the time.
Are white people racist? Some are, not all of them.
Do white women love black men? Some do, not all of them.


There are few things in the world which you can categorize under "ALL".
If you say the Confederate Flag sometimes represents racism, then I agree. But if you say that it always does, and anyone who reps it is a racist. I'm gonna call you out on your ignorance.

Assuming that someone is racist because they have a confederate flag is like assuming a white girl loves black guys just because she's white.

Common sense shows us that usually it's "Some not all"
 
It should be said that the Nazi Swastika is slightly different from the original, even though Hitler used the original in some circumstances. Even though Western Esoteric interpretation of Eastern philosophy/mysticism/magic had waned in it's popularity, Hitler was influenced in that school as well as other occult arts. The Nazi inverted flag means something completely different.
 
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xoxo said:
Let's not compare it with the nazi flag, which is more charged. No performer would think about wearing it on stage, no one is that bold or ignorant. Let's not bring up an ADL vs NAACP argument either, or who goes harder against such things. The Nazi Flag is much more charged with negativity than the confederate flag, for many reasons.
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Yes of course it's definitely more charged. That's a given. That wasn't my point at all. My point was that - both flags are representative of hatred, not the levels of each one. As a majority/collective (not getting into the minority of people who don't see anything wrong with the Confederate flag), we look at these flags as in symbolic in nature and they each have negative connotation that goes along with it/them.
 
Nico said:
I'm just trying to understand this. Cause in my history books the originally meaning of the Swastika was of Hinduism.

Yet we call people racist for displaying a Swastika flag.


So it's ok to change the meaning of a Swastika to something negative.....but it's not ok to change the meaning of The Confederate Flag to something positive?

Just confused by this, please clear it up for me.
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The. Confederate. Flag. Is. Still. Considered. Racist. Because. The. Majority. Of. People. Who. Rep. It. Still. Rep. It. For That. Reason. Despite. The. Efforts. That. Have. Been. Taken. To. Turn. It. Into. A. Symbol. Of. Southern. Pride. Which. Was. Actually. Brought. About. To. Keep. The. Conferedate. Flag. Alive. Despite. It's. Original. And. True. Meaning.

It. Was. Resurrected. In. The. 1950's. By. Southern. Whites. Who. Opposed. The. Early. Civil. Rights. Movement. Because. Of. The. Very. Racist. Connotations. That. It. Held. To. Be. A. Symbol. In. Order. To. Intimidate. Black. People. At. The. Time. Because. All. Black. People. Then. Knew. What. The. Confederate. Flag. Stood. For. In. All. It's. Glory.
 
Nico said:
Ah someone with a brain around here.

Well the way I see it, some white still have a negative reaction to black people or...... interracial couples?;) Doesn't mean they're right though.
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huh? What's the connection?

Nico said:
I don't see whats hard for people to understand about this. It's a case of "Some not all"
Is the confederate flag a sign of racism? Sometimes not all the time.
Are white people racist? Some are, not all of them.
Do white women love black men? Some do, not all of them.
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Why are you bringing IR in to this?


Nico said:
Assuming that someone is racist because they have a confederate flag is like assuming a white girl loves black guys just because she's white.
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huh?


Nico said:
There are few things in the world which you can categorize under "ALL".
If you say the Confederate Flag sometimes represents racism, then I agree.
But if you say that it always does, and anyone who reps it is a racist. I'm gonna call you out on your ignorance.
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Don't conflate those arguments. Eye of Ra has stated that he never made such a claim about individuals being racist. I think you need to further your argument of it sometimes not being racist? Is the flag in of itself racist? or does someone need to make it racist? Compare it with the Nazi flag in that respects, if you want.
 
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