wtarshi
Well-Known Member
well this is true, think there is a bumper sticker out there to that effect somewhere out there. that and the 'member of tarshi's sunshine's out of your ass club'
Post Of The Day
- Thread starter The Dark King
- Start date
well this is true, think there is a bumper sticker out there to that effect somewhere out there. that and the 'member of tarshi's sunshine's out of your ass club'
nocturnalmission
New Member
Definite Props to MrFantastic for bringing this one to the table! The discussion thus far has been enlightening and interesting...
While reading the inputs, I was reminded of a phase in the military that attempted to help managers and supervisors understand their subordinates. Part of the training model used was Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs, which attempted to explain how our development was tied to meeting specific needs and how ultimate needs could not be met until the the needs below them were met ...
One could point out a lot of flaws in Maslow's overall premise and even the methodology he used to arrive at his conclusion but here, when I think about relationships and the elements of wants, needs, expectancies, desires, love, dependency, responsibility and whatever else you want to throw into Pandora's treasure chest, the more apparent it is to me that each of us defines things in our own ways, each of us has had different life experiences that influenced us differently and that while such things as perfection and ideal may be utopian and unachievable, most of us try to strive toward something close to perfection or the "dream", personally and professionally.
Interaction with another human being can always be unpredictable. In relationships, something you might have found "cute" yesterday may get on your nerves today. The reasons for a meltdown/conflict could be one or many... emotional, psychological, physiological, or even chemical...., but whenever someone disturbs our comfort zone, even if the reaction is to only mumble under one's breath, we react. And in many cases, the other person will respond in someway to our reaction, even if that response is a meltdown of their own.
There are no perfect relationships but I believe that successful relationships (for the sake of this submission, I'll define successful as relationships that bring both people some general measure of happiness) require routine maintenance. It might be overstated and we all it hear often from the "experts", but communication is a key to bringing about understanding... In a conflict, we can out talk, loud talk, or even knutt up but those strategies do not always bring resolution. Just because you silence a man does not mean you've changed his mind... as the saying goes.
When I say I need my lady, that is not to say that I would die without her, although I'm sure you've all heard or read about a spouse dying shortly after the death of their mate (broken heart? will to live?). In my making such a statement it does say the she makes me happy and that our relationship is essential to my sense of being and important in the world/empire/realm I live in.
I would be one to say that I would anything for my lady but caveat that with the phrase "within reason". But what might be reasonable for me, may not be for the next man...
While reading the inputs, I was reminded of a phase in the military that attempted to help managers and supervisors understand their subordinates. Part of the training model used was Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs, which attempted to explain how our development was tied to meeting specific needs and how ultimate needs could not be met until the the needs below them were met ...
One could point out a lot of flaws in Maslow's overall premise and even the methodology he used to arrive at his conclusion but here, when I think about relationships and the elements of wants, needs, expectancies, desires, love, dependency, responsibility and whatever else you want to throw into Pandora's treasure chest, the more apparent it is to me that each of us defines things in our own ways, each of us has had different life experiences that influenced us differently and that while such things as perfection and ideal may be utopian and unachievable, most of us try to strive toward something close to perfection or the "dream", personally and professionally.
Interaction with another human being can always be unpredictable. In relationships, something you might have found "cute" yesterday may get on your nerves today. The reasons for a meltdown/conflict could be one or many... emotional, psychological, physiological, or even chemical...., but whenever someone disturbs our comfort zone, even if the reaction is to only mumble under one's breath, we react. And in many cases, the other person will respond in someway to our reaction, even if that response is a meltdown of their own.
There are no perfect relationships but I believe that successful relationships (for the sake of this submission, I'll define successful as relationships that bring both people some general measure of happiness) require routine maintenance. It might be overstated and we all it hear often from the "experts", but communication is a key to bringing about understanding... In a conflict, we can out talk, loud talk, or even knutt up but those strategies do not always bring resolution. Just because you silence a man does not mean you've changed his mind... as the saying goes.
When I say I need my lady, that is not to say that I would die without her, although I'm sure you've all heard or read about a spouse dying shortly after the death of their mate (broken heart? will to live?). In my making such a statement it does say the she makes me happy and that our relationship is essential to my sense of being and important in the world/empire/realm I live in.
I would be one to say that I would anything for my lady but caveat that with the phrase "within reason". But what might be reasonable for me, may not be for the next man...
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suprchic73
New Member
:smt038 FRESH - I love this!! It's said absolutely perfectly. IMO, this is the post of the day.
The Dark King
Well-Known Member
Try again please. That was yesterday's post. Pick one from today.
suprchic73
New Member
well, i didn't read it until today, so in my world it's today's post of the day.
besides, why the hell are the time stamps all jacked up?
The Dark King
Well-Known Member
well, i didn't read it until today, so in my world it's today's post of the day.
Seems fine to me and after thinking about I withdraw my previous statement. This is all about apprecation so praise whatever post you like no matter the day.
suprchic73
New Member
Thanks.
My time stamp is messed up - like it says your last post was at 8:46pm today. it's only 6:34pm, and me and you are in the same time zone. I don't get it.
The Dark King
Well-Known Member
My submission for post of the day by NocturnalMission in the one way attraction thread. Great post my dude:
First, I'll say that beauty is in the eye of the beholder... What you might consider gorgeous or beautiful another might find average or unattractive. Even more, you might peel back that exterior facade and find an ogre underneath. Several responses have tried to suggest that's it' not all about looks. You should take heed and rethink what you currently hold to be true. I believe that character and chemistry play greater roles than superficial things like looks.
I'd also caution you about your persistence... If a woman if not interested for whatever reason, no will still mean NO and you run the risk of developing a reputation of being a pest, of being creepy, or worse...
Self-confidence is aptly titled because it's about the self, the "I", the "Me".... It doesn't begin with approaching anyone but the person who stares back at you when you look in the mirror. How you view yourself and know yourself will speak volumes, even in a crowded room.
That is why most(black) men are not happy if pretty (white) women do not want them, but we always keep trying whatever it takes.
I won't even beat up this erroneous statement... I'll assume you took a poll to come up with the not happy theory....
Slow your roll and lighten up... Your choice of a mate will be something that is mutually agreed upon by two of you. She will let you know if she's interested. It may not be the neon sign advertising "Vacancy", but you'll catch the signs if you are tuned in...
Oh, and one last thing... magnets only attract ferro(iron)magnetic objects and those objects need to be within the proximity of the magnetic field before the magic can begin to work. That's that character and chemistry in humans...
First, I'll say that beauty is in the eye of the beholder... What you might consider gorgeous or beautiful another might find average or unattractive. Even more, you might peel back that exterior facade and find an ogre underneath. Several responses have tried to suggest that's it' not all about looks. You should take heed and rethink what you currently hold to be true. I believe that character and chemistry play greater roles than superficial things like looks.
I'd also caution you about your persistence... If a woman if not interested for whatever reason, no will still mean NO and you run the risk of developing a reputation of being a pest, of being creepy, or worse...
Self-confidence is aptly titled because it's about the self, the "I", the "Me".... It doesn't begin with approaching anyone but the person who stares back at you when you look in the mirror. How you view yourself and know yourself will speak volumes, even in a crowded room.
That is why most(black) men are not happy if pretty (white) women do not want them, but we always keep trying whatever it takes.
I won't even beat up this erroneous statement... I'll assume you took a poll to come up with the not happy theory....
Slow your roll and lighten up... Your choice of a mate will be something that is mutually agreed upon by two of you. She will let you know if she's interested. It may not be the neon sign advertising "Vacancy", but you'll catch the signs if you are tuned in...
Oh, and one last thing... magnets only attract ferro(iron)magnetic objects and those objects need to be within the proximity of the magnetic field before the magic can begin to work. That's that character and chemistry in humans...
Ymra
New Member
ahhh the impetuousness of youth. I watched my father glorify the farts my mother made. This massive, gruff, aggressive, powerful man treated my mother as he raised his voice she would whither away.
If my mother wanted, my father made it happy. I can still remember her voice when he would do little things for her. "awww baby" and giggle like a school girl. She in turned treated him like the man he was.
The problem is we say "Oh this is the new style" or "its not the 60s" as if those times gone by where somehow bad (with regards to families) and if the current state of our society is better. Its not. Men today want an excuse not to be men, an excuse not to work and strive, and excuse not to treat the very giver's of life as less than.
And so we have our roles twisted....and we can sit back and watch while our families deteriorate. While our men run out on our women. While our young boys struggle to find and example of that which they should be. This post really amounts crying and complaining "Why do I have to be a man"
He depended on her, and she depended on him. My mother died in September of 2003 and my father died almost a year September 2004.
I am not perfect and have many many mistakes in my life, but I was raised by a man, who loved his woman.
That is the example that I have.
FRESH
New Member
This.
moddestmike
New Member
I really do understand what Fresh is stating, after all it is the view of the majority amongst the world. But "leading" a woman/spouse still gives a sense of father-ship to the relationship. More so it should be mutual growth, leading (and trusting that he will guide her righteously) leaves no room for personal growth. Adults should not be led under any circumstances but this solely my opinion.
suprchic73
New Member
I totally get where you're coming from, I honestly do, and I think your perspective is shared by a lot of members of society. A man "leading" or being the "head of household" has somehow become a negative thing...the same with the idea of a woman being submissive to her man. My husband and I have been together for a total of 11 1/2yrs, and married for almost 4 of those years -- he does play the role of "leading" in our home...it's not a father-ship role at all, and I'm not a passive/timid woman either...it's just how we work. We make decisions together, and he knows where I stand always, but I allow him to have the final say. I submit to him and he gladly takes the role of leading/guiding. It's like FRESH said - nothing to do with him creating dependencies for me or him trying to control me, but it's a trust thing. It's about mutual respect, love and loyalty. I'm very independent, I work F/T, and I'm a full time mom to our daughter...and honestly, it's the best feeling in the world knowing that I have someone who I love and who loves me, and who I know is gonna have my back no matter what...I know that I can trust him to "take care of me" when I need him too, and vice versa. It might not be right for everybody, but for some couples, it really does work. :smt001
I hope that makes some kind of sense, lol.
Ymra
New Member
I think you believe this because you don't understand it. You are coming at this as an absolute. One lead. One follows. And it is simply not that simple. If a man is the leader of his home it doesn't mean is the a dictator, or a ruler. He doesn't rule with a iron fist, on the contrary. Leadership doesn't mean always being the one to make all the decisions.
A leader is a person who guides his toward a common goal, showing the way by example, and creating an environment in which his woman feels actively involved in the entire process. A leader is not the boss of his woman, instead, the person that is committed to carrying out the goal of the family. To love, and grow.
A leader is focused, organized, available, decisive and confident. A leader knows he can't do it all. Understands that while he me decide the direction the way to get to that goal may be better suited to another.
The leader of a home guides. Sometimes he forges the way, and other times he covers the rear. So many of our young men don't know what a leader is. I think it wrong to say "a human doesn't need to be lead" Actually I'm not even sure that statement makes much sense.
If not one leads then there is utter chaos...
...and in the black community we can see that played out ever day.
suprchic73
New Member
This is gold - so much goodness in this post. Love it. :smt045
The Dark King
Well-Known Member
So basically do as I say because I know better? The one who leads also carries the power to discipline much like the military right?
The idea that a man should lead only supports the idea being male makes you better suited to lead not experience. I'm not saying you're wrong just how it cones across to me. I believe the less knowledgable need to be lead and guided and it seems like that's the position women are put in by default and it's contradictary to the idea of equal rights in my opinion. We're not equal if I get final say.
moddestmike
New Member
Does he lead because he has more experience and ALWAYS knows better or is it just because he is the man and societies perception of the male-female relationship dictates such?
On the contrary, society still by and large views the male as the dominant figure in the home and male leadership as the norm. I was raised in a household where mutual responsibility was shared. I cant remember a time when my mom "submitted" to my dad. There was never a time where my dad played the leadership role (at least not that I can remember). It was a logical, mutual relationship in which decisions were logically made by both. If there was a disagreement, they would discuss it and come to a conclusion based on who had the better experience and knowledge of such. I know many women (make that about 80-90%) feel the need to be guided in a sense as men define this as a feminine trait and any woman who attempts a role at leadership is viewed as a feminist, but the truth is this mentality will always keep women at the lower end of the earning spectrum and many other areas where males dominate.
My dad was employed as a Engineer and my mom owned a small franchise of daycares. Whoever got home first picked up the kids, cooked and cleaned so the other didn't have to. Family vacation? Driving was split 50/50. Need directions? Whoever was more familiar with the area mapped out the trip. My mom was a hardcore go getter (would be considered an aspiring feminist by todays standards), her attitude accompanied by my dads perspective of equal partnership made for one awesome childhood. They did their best to work the same amount of hours so that they may spend equal time with us. There was never a time where my mom dominated in the responsibilities of taking care of us. Thats just flat out insanity in my opinion.
My parents raised 4 boys with the philosophy of "no one is dominant", and I must say it has benefited my brothers and I immensely. It showed me that my dad does not indeed know everything. I also learned a level of respect for relationships that go far beyond what many assume to know. My future wife shouldn't expect me to leader her or have the final say, but to include her in the decision making process.
There will never come a time in which I assume that a woman needs to be led without the accompanying assumption that she may want to be led to feel safe. Just my opinion, but this is a cop-out for personal responsibility. Men posses no more brain or will than women and for a female to desire a man lead her is highly unattractive in my opinion.
Although I do seem to encounter those who share your philosophy, and they are usually the more religious crowd. Not a shot at you by any means but its a consistent commonality that I've observed throughout the hundreds of discussions I've had on this very topic.
I don't plan on having kids but if I ever do, I'll be sure and teach my daughter that she ALWAYS knows whats best for herself.
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wtarshi
Well-Known Member
i would also like to throw in that generally, the leader of the home is usually a woman
moddestmike
New Member
This statement makes the assumption that the male ALWAYS knows best and has the experience to guide 100%.
And for the record I said "no ADULT needs to be led" . Seek knowledge for yourself. Don't depend on others, husband or wife for that matter; to guide you.
moddestmike
New Member
This pretty much sums it up for me.