Dear Black People

[The Dark King]

"Our" history? What part of "our" history do we say we should never forget? What you fail to realize is that white folks don't have the same sense of community that black folks do. We don't bond together against a common enemy. I know I don't feel any sort of allegiance to other white folks just because they're white. I do, however, feel that bond with fellow Americans, particularly in the face of foreign hostility.

Well there you go. You still hear about never forgetting Pearl Harbor and that shit was damn near 80 years ago and the Japanese are our allies now. And as we keep seeing in this country white people seem to ban together in support of the police when they kill black people. Of course its not every single white person but hell if the voices aren't loud when calling Tryvon Martin a thug or Tamir Rice's parents irresponsible drug users.

 

[Cherok33]

Ches (I believe it was she) made an excellent point. Black people will read her letter and may not feel it is genuine. However to the contrary, they may read with an open mind and consider her letter to be well thought-through having an honest expression of opening up the unspoken dialogue between the races. She chose her powerful and educated words carefully, and I do respect her for having the courage it took to make it public.

White people (her race) can choose to either view her as a traitor if they are closed minded and/or racist, or they may take the opportunity to educate themselves about the history the world and the relationship we have painfully shared.

I say good for her! Anytime we can open up the lines of communication and HEAR AND LISTEN to each other it's a small step towards positive change and unification. There are many scars that prove this is such a sensitive issue and we need to heal those wounds and realize we are all so different and so much the SAME.

 

[orejon4]

I appreciate the apparently heartfelt sentiment behind her open letter. However, I do feel that many whites who do not share them may reflexively react in the opposite direction and accuse her of being a "self-hating" white person.

In response to the discussion about the tendency to bond among black Americans as opposed to others, the tendency toward group identity is stronger the more a group of people are oppressed because of a common characteristic. "Whiteness" is strongest as an abstract concept around which to organize in response to a real or perceived attack. The nationalist pro-US sentiment in response to foreign threats is often a surrogate for such sentiments, because being an "all-American" is often a shorthand for some sort of white identify politics. Even though the nation is a pluralist construct, as the dominant group, whites are able (even if they choose not to) to think of the nation-state as an extension of their identity.

 

[Ches]

Great point. We are literally the only people told to move on from our pain yet everyone else gets to hold theirs up to the world to make sure it never happens again. I recently heard a Jewish woman say "But it's so fresh" in reference to the holocaust as if modern day Jim Crow is a thing of the past. Hell if you want to play that game the civil rights act is a hell of a lot more recent than the holocaust. Not to play oppression olympics but fuck if it ain't annoying though.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Pearl Harbor wasn't a "white" tragedy. It was an American tragedy. The Holocaust wasn't a "white" tragedy It was a Jewish tragedy. Yes, those killed were predominately white, but they weren't killed because they're white. We, collectively as white people, don't look back on those events the same way as black people look at slavery.

I've said this before here: There are indeed a lot of calloused and uneducated people who tell you to forget about the past. I don't deny that. It's not their monkey, not their circus so they don't want to hear it. But for those of us who care enough to listen and ask questions and research that history, as much as we know it plays a part in life today and the future, many people want to blame all their personal ills on the past. I've seen it in discussions. Yet, the men here are, for the most part, a testament to the fact that the past doesn't have to dictate the future.

There are too many educated, successful black folks that have gotten to where they are despite their history, for others to keep using slavery as a reason they're oppressed. Does that make sense? One guy can come out of a single parent home, in a disenfranchised area and becomes a highly respected doctor, but the kid next to him in class, from the same environment, is selling drugs on the street and has a rap sheet a mile long because he had no opportunities, life is stacked against him because he's black and it all goes back to slavery. One maybe sees the past as a springboard, the other sees it as a trap he can never escape.

As a side note, what's particularly frustrating is people who themselves have never been held as a slave (don't get that confused with "has never experienced oppression") but treats all white people as slave owners. I don't know when my ancestors came to this country, but my family is from the north and were never wealthy so it's likely they never had slaves. So for someone to accuse me of having slave holding ancestors simply because I'm white is just as frustrating as what is often assumed about black people. It's a wall. We need to create bridges.

I'm not trying to deflect blame here. Racism is a white problem and it's up to us to fix it. I wholeheartedly agree with that. But I see that there are perceptions that have taken hold in the black community that are also fueled by hate and as long as they are used as shields, white folks who are trying to change things can't.

Just my thoughts. I'm sure someone will pick this apart and take it with the wrong spirit. But if we're going to have open dialogue about race, we ALL have to be willing to listen and recognize that our perceptions might be wrong. The women here have certainly heard plenty from the male component about their perceptions of and experiences with white folks, even when very unfavorable. I hope you can respectfully listen to an opinion from one of us.

 

[The Dark King]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Pearl Harbor wasn't a "white" tragedy. It was an American tragedy. The Holocaust wasn't a "white" tragedy It was a Jewish tragedy. Yes, those killed were predominately white, but they weren't killed because they're white. We, collectively as white people, don't look back on those events the same way as black people look at slavery.

I've said this before here: There are indeed a lot of calloused and uneducated people who tell you to forget about the past. I don't deny that. It's not their monkey, not their circus so they don't want to hear it. But for those of us who care enough to listen and ask questions and research that history, as much as we know it plays a part in life today and the future, many people want to blame all their personal ills on the past. I've seen it in discussions. Yet, the men here are, for the most part, a testament to the fact that the past doesn't have to dictate the future.

There are too many educated, successful black folks that have gotten to where they are despite their history, for others to keep using slavery as a reason they're oppressed. Does that make sense? One guy can come out of a single parent home, in a disenfranchised area and becomes a highly respected doctor, but the kid next to him in class, from the same environment, is selling drugs on the street and has a rap sheet a mile long because he had no opportunities, life is stacked against him because he's black and it all goes back to slavery. One maybe sees the past as a springboard, the other sees it as a trap he can never escape.

As a side note, what's particularly frustrating is people who themselves have never been held as a slave (don't get that confused with "has never experienced oppression") but treats all white people as slave owners. I don't know when my ancestors came to this country, but my family is from the north and were never wealthy so it's likely they never had slaves. So for someone to accuse me of having slave holding ancestors simply because I'm white is just as frustrating as what is often assumed about black people. It's a wall. We need to create bridges.

I'm not trying to deflect blame here. Racism is a white problem and it's up to us to fix it. I wholeheartedly agree with that. But I see that there are perceptions that have taken hold in the black community that are also fueled by hate and as long as they are used as shields, white folks who are trying to change things can't.

Just my thoughts. I'm sure someone will pick this apart and take it with the wrong spirit. But if we're going to have open dialogue about race, we ALL have to be willing to listen and recognize that our perceptions might be wrong. The women here have certainly heard plenty from the male component about their perceptions of and experiences with white folks, even when very unfavorable. I hope you can respectfully listen to an opinion from one of us.

Well here's something to think about. Why us Pearl Harbor an American tragedy yet slavery is a black one?
Do you see the cognitive dissonance that lays the bricks to the wall to begin with. It's constantly being treated like an outside then people getting made when you don't assimilate in a way that makes them comfortable.
Anyone who acts if all white people were slave owners are dumb and probably aren't worth the conversation time.
However when a lot of uneducated blacks connect oppression to slavery it's more to say this shit is a continuous train that started all the way back then. The cars may look different but it's the same train. They may not be able to openly lynch for looking at masters daughter but they sure as fuck can choke me on camera and say it was my fault for dying. This stuff doesn't happen in a vacuum.
I appreciate your input keep giving it but understand that it won't always be met favorably and that's OK we're just trying to move forward and educate ourselves.

 

[Ches]

Well here's something to think about. Why us Pearl Harbor an American tragedy yet slavery is a black one?
Do you see the cognitive dissonance that lays the bricks to the wall to begin with. It's constantly being treated like an outside then people getting made when you don't assimilate in a way that makes them comfortable.
Anyone who acts if all white people were slave owners are dumb and probably aren't worth the conversation time.
However when a lot of uneducated blacks connect oppression to slavery it's more to say this shit is a continuous train that started all the way back then. The cars may look different but it's the same train. They may not be able to openly lynch for looking at masters daughter but they sure as fuck can choke me on camera and say it was my fault for dying. This stuff doesn't happen in a vacuum.
I appreciate your input keep giving it but understand that it won't always be met favorably and that's OK we're just trying to move forward and educate ourselves.

Slavery IS an American tragedy but not the same way Pearl Harbor was. Pearl Harbor was an assault on America (not white people), slavery was an assault on black people only. One was non-discriminating, one discriminated against race.

 

[The Dark King]

Slavery IS an American tragedy but not the same way Pearl Harbor was. Pearl Harbor was an assault on America, slavery was an assault on black people only.

And this very statement is why you're going to continue to meet resistance and been seen a certain way. Smh
Carry on Ches

 

[JamahlSharif]

Slavery IS an American tragedy but not the same way Pearl Harbor was. Pearl Harbor was an assault on America, slavery was an assault on black people only.

Not true. There were most definitely white and native american slaves....as well as black plantation owners.

 

[Ches]

And this very statement is why you're going to continue to meet resistance and been seen a certain way. Smh
Carry on Ches

I edited. I don't think you're reading it the way I'm intending. Read it in the context of your comment to Rita about our "collective" history. Pearl Harbor was not an assault on white people. Slavery, in this country, was primarily an assault against black people.

 

[Beasty]

Slavery IS an American tragedy but not the same way Pearl Harbor was. Pearl Harbor was an assault on America (not white peoole), slavery was an assault on black people only. One was non-discriminating, one discriminated against race.

Not true. There were most definitely white and native american slaves....as well as black plantation owners.

One day people will learn that racism is simply a division tactic and that the affluent class could care less about non affluent whites. That day seems very far into the future.

 

[JamahlSharif]

One day people will learn that racism is simply a division tactic and that the affluent class could care less about non affluent whites. That day seems very far into the future.

#FACTS

 

[Gorath]

Let's say you work for 2 weeks and on the day you are to get paid for those 2 weeks of work you find you account has been credited for only this current day. Furious, you head to HR to find out what happened to the complete prior days and your pay for those days and the HR administrator tells you:

"I say to hell with history. It's in the past."

You would be cool with that?

I work at Wal-Mart. I am forbidden to work over 40 hours a week because of the word from the corporation. Things like that don't happen because Wal-Mart doesn't want to be sued. Every associate working in the store knows who in HR to see. And everyone also is seen by an assistant manager who keeps track of every associate's hours. So if Wal-Mart took two weeks from me, they will see me in court.

When I say to hell with history. It's in the past. I am saying that no matter what, I am moving forward. No one is going to stop me on my life journey. I've been through a lot in my life. The good, the bad, and the ugly. It's all in the past and I've decided to move forward toward better things. I stand alone. And I am very much at peace with that. I have dreams and goals that I want to achieve. At this time in my age, decisions about life must be made. I am in commandin my life and I run a tight ship even though I am not perfect, but the ship sails on. The journey on the oceans and seas of life are unpredictable. All I can do is not let the past get in the way. In this life, you are on your own. You have a choice; go back, because it's all you know, stay put because you're afraid, or go forward because you want a change in life.
Pick any path you choose. It's your life. Let nothing or no one stand in the way of your dreams and goals. History doesn't determine your destiny. I AM. And so are you and everyone else here on this site and the entire world. This is why I say , loud and clear; to he'll with history. It's in the past.

 

[The Dark King]

I edited. I don't think you're reading it the way I'm intending. Read it in the context of your comment to Rita about our "collective" history. Pearl Harbor was not an assault on white people. Slavery, in this country, was primarily an assault against black people.

Pearl Harbor was an assault on one naval base in Hawaii, slavery and jim crow was a national tragedy felt by millions of this country's citizens and for a far longer period of time. And many minority groups who are socially conscious very much get that blacks sacrificed and fought for the collective. There would be no women's right movement, no gay rights movement if there wasn't a black movement first.

 

[Gorath]

I appreciate the apparently heartfelt sentiment behind her open letter. However, I do feel that many whites who do not share them may reflexively react in the opposite direction and accuse her of being a "self-hating" white person.

In response to the discussion about the tendency to bond among black Americans as opposed to others, the tendency toward group identity is stronger the more a group of people are oppressed because of a common characteristic. "Whiteness" is strongest as an abstract concept around which to organize in response to a real or perceived attack. The nationalist pro-US sentiment in response to foreign threats is often a surrogate for such sentiments, because being an "all-American" is often a shorthand for some sort of white identify politics. Even though the nation is a pluralist construct, as the dominant group, whites are able (even if they choose not to) to think of the nation-state as an extension of their identity.

White guilt is viewed as shameful. White guilt is viewed as a sign of surrender. As far as they, who believe that they have nothing to be sorry for and apologize to no one. Shit happens and they shrug it off.

It's easy for white racists to think this way.

 

[Ches]

Pearl Harbor was an assault on one naval base in Hawaii, slavery and jim crow was a national tragedy felt by millions of this country's citizens and for a far longer period of time. And many minority groups who are socially conscious very much get that blacks sacrificed and fought for the collective. There would be no women's right movement, no gay rights movement if there wasn't a black movement first.

You're not understanding my point. I'm not, in any way, making Pearl Harbor to be superior or slavery to be inferior in importance and I'm not negating what you're saying.You asked why people say to remember PH but not slavery. PH was an attack against our military as a representative of America which included all people - black white, etc. I'm not saying we should remember one but not the other, only making the distinction that one was not perpetrated against a particular segment of the population.

 

[The Dark King]

You're not understanding my point. I'm not, in any way, making Pearl Harbor to be superior or slavery to be inferior in importance and I'm not negating what you're saying.You asked why people say to remember PH but not slavery. PH was an attack against our military as a representative of America which included all people - black white, etc. I'm not saying we should remember one but not the other, only making the distinction that one was not perpetrated against a particular segment of the population.

I do understand what you're saying I'm just trying to point out the flaw in that way of thinking. An attack and the potential loss of life vs the actual loss of life why is it we are called to remember one as a nation and the other we simply tell those whiners to shut up and get over it.

 

[Gorath]

Pearl Harbor was an assault on one naval base in Hawaii, slavery and jim crow was a national tragedy felt by millions of this country's citizens and for a far longer period of time. And many minority groups who are socially conscious very much get that blacks sacrificed and fought for the collective. There would be no women's right movement, no gay rights movement if there wasn't a black movement first.

The attack on Pearl Harbor was planned because the Japanese military felt that the U.S. military presence there gave the Americans a strategic advantage in the Pacific theater. Nissei(second generation Japanese citizens born in America) were interned in camps because of the attack. Those young men who were of age in the camps were given a chance to volunteer to join the military and fight. Many joined and a small number stayed because of the resentment of the system and conditions at the camps(the Japanese internees had to deal with weather, disease, cramped quarters, and the barracks were not completely finished and the internees had to finish up the construction). Those who signed up to serve went to fight in the European theater. The Japanese American units faced a lot of racism. They fought in a major skirmish, only to lose credit by having an all-white unit come in afterwards to take the credit. It was the same for all the other minorities, especially black men in the Americans military services. Even Mexican-Americans and other Latino men served. The Japanese Americans who had businesses and homes were all taken from them. WW2 was very hard on everyone.

 

[Ches]

I do understand what you're saying I'm just trying to point out the flaw in that way of thinking. An attack and the potential loss of life vs the actual loss of life why is it we are called to remember one as a nation and the other we simply tell those whiners to shut up and get over it.

Again, I made my comments in the context of your comment to Rita. And, as I mentioned earlier, some want to blame all their personal ills on the past. PH isn't viewed that way.

Ugh. Too much is lost sometimes in trying to convey thoughts in writing. I feel like I could write this a hundred different ways and I still won't be heard the way I intend.

 

[JamahlSharif]

Again, I made my comments in the context of your comment to Rita. And, as I mentioned earlier, some want to blame all their personal ills on the past. PH isn't viewed that way.

Ugh. Too much is lost sometimes in trying to convey thoughts in writing. I feel like I could write this a hundred different ways and I still won't be heard the way I intend.

I've not once heard anyone blame their personal position in life on slavery....where are all of these people that do this? Now insitutuonal/systematic white supremacy?...absolutely.

The problem is, when you talk about the latter...there's usually a connection made to the former.

 

[BrianJ]

Ches (I believe it was she) made an excellent point. Black people will read her letter and may not feel it is genuine. However to the contrary, they may read with an open mind and consider her letter to be well thought-through having an honest expression of opening up the unspoken dialogue between the races. She chose her powerful and educated words carefully, and I do respect her for having the courage it took to make it public.

White people (her race) can choose to either view her as a traitor if they are closed minded and/or racist, or they may take the opportunity to educate themselves about the history the world and the relationship we have painfully shared.

I say good for her! Anytime we can open up the lines of communication and HEAR AND LISTEN to each other it's a small step towards positive change and unification. There are many scars that prove this is such a sensitive issue and we need to heal those wounds and realize we are all so different and so much the SAME.

I concur. Very well stated.