Zombie Fans : Walking Dead Season 2 Starts Tonight.

[The Dark King]

Aren't you the the dude always talking about moving to some white centric black man utopia because America is too damn racist but can't grasp the concept of how a sociopath could hold sway over other people where what passes for the rules of civilization have actually gone out the window???

Wow huge over simplification of my motives. How about just wanting to move somewhere where the history of racism isn't the literal narrative of nearly every conversation and some place where the government actually cares about the people it governs. Didn't know that was utopia lol

 

[The Dark King]

It wasn't just the loyalty of killing loved ones, it was the army he had. I don't believe he started out that way, but as time went on, his tactics proved more violent in accordance with the surrounding world. Comfort or not, people like that have always existed and people have followed them out of fear, admiration, and the feeling of superiority that comes with following a guy like that. Jim Crow era and before... heck, technically even now guys like that existed and still do today ( they just wear certain uniforms). The tricky part is that there aren't any laws or avenues of protest in TWD, so I see your point there.

The problem with TWD scenario is that Negan isn't a force that they have necessarily dealt with before. They had the upper hand and it isn't just killing your loved ones, but more the idea that you can keep them safe by complying with his way of life.

I agree with Boba I don't get how everyone is willing to follow a barbarian like that. And remember his tactic isn't us vs them it's do what I say or what I did to your best friend husband son father lover will happen to you. This wasn't just about him kill8ng their men this is how they intimidate people. It's their way of showing we're in charge and we dont give a fuck. That's the part that's so far fetched for me. Most asshole dictators use others as catalyst to give reason for this thing, here are the people to blame but his tactics rely on people being so afraid of his brutality they won't do anything against him. I'm world of literal monsters he's just another man. Fuck his army he has to sleep he has to eat he has to let his guard down. And if his common practice is killing loved ones in front of people then how hard is it to recruit people to stand against him too.

 

[Stizzy]

I agree with Boba I don't get how everyone is willing to follow a barbarian like that. And remember his tactic isn't us vs them it's do what I say or what I did to your best friend husband son father lover will happen to you. This wasn't just about him kill8ng their men this is how they intimidate people. It's their way of showing we're in charge and we dont give a fuck. That's the part that's so far fetched for me. Most asshole dictators use others as catalyst to give reason for this thing, here are the people to blame but his tactics rely on people being so afraid of his brutality they won't do anything against him. I'm world of literal monsters he's just another man. Fuck his army he has to sleep he has to eat he has to let his guard down. And if his common practice is killing loved ones in front of people then how hard is it to recruit people to stand against him too.

The same way people followed Hitler's rule. And that was real life, not acting.

 

[andreboba]

The same way people followed Hitler's rule. And that was real life, not acting.

Hitler got away with genocide because he HID HIS HORRIFIC CRIMES from the majority of German citizens.

If Hitler set up gas chambers in Berlin he would have been overthrown IMO in less than 2 years.


The Governor hid his own sadistic tendencies from most of his people.

Negan is doing his sick shit in front of ALL of his ARMED Saviors.


Most people will eat sausage and hamburger, but not if they have to watch how it was made.

Negan isn't showing the Saviors he's a tough, strong leader.
He's demonstrating to his followers by pulverizing the skulls of Abraham and Glenn that he's a monster.

Fear(of retribution) is a powerful motivator for most people.
Horror is not.

The 'best' dictators make their enemies disappear, they don't slaughter them in public.

 

[darkcurry]

Well here's a question do they ever explain why they follow him? Especially so loyally.

 

[andreboba]

Well here's a question do they ever explain why they follow him? Especially so loyally.

Following a brutal or wartime leader is both parts fear and respect.

If you base you power on 100% fear, people tend to try to destroy what terrifies them.

I get the fear part with Negan. But do his people respect him??

Compare Negan to Rick.
Anytime Rick has gotten a little too violent or psycho, his crew starts giving hm that 'look' like maybe Rick has lost it and shouldn't be in control anymore.

And Rick's capacity for violence is nearly as great as Negan's.

You don't think if Rick could have killed every single on of those Saviors to rescue his own group, he wouldn't have done it???

Rick is a murderous psychopath too, but only under certain circumstances.
He has a code I sort of understand.
Negan?? Not really.


No, the writers of TWD don't have to explain why the Saviors follow Negan. Every one of the characters on TWD is broken in some way because of the upside down world they live in.

However as a fan it's hard to follow the logic of Negan's power, authority and control.
He just seems to be evil for evil's sake and for some reason the Saviors trust him with their lives.


Ironically, if Negan was the head of a smaller group, that would make more sense because it would suggest he had a hard time finding followers.

The problem is the Saviors are the largest group of survivors we've ever seen on TWD.

Why??

 

[Stizzy]

Hitler got away with genocide because he HID HIS HORRIFIC CRIMES from the majority of German citizens.

If Hitler set up gas chambers in Berlin he would have been overthrown IMO in less than 2 years.


The Governor hid his own sadistic tendencies from most of his people.

Negan is doing his sick shit in front of ALL of his ARMED Saviors.


Most people will eat sausage and hamburger, but not if they have to watch how it was made.

Negan isn't showing the Saviors he's a tough, strong leader.
He's demonstrating to his followers by pulverizing the skulls of Abraham and Glenn that he's a monster.

Fear(of retribution) is a powerful motivator for most people.
Horror is not.

The 'best' dictators make their enemies disappear, they don't slaughter them in public.

Who made the people follow Hitler??

And Remember, this is the apocalypse. You need numbers. Negan isn't making the most disappear Bc he want numbers.

 

[Stizzy]

Following a brutal or wartime leader is both parts fear and respect.

If you base you power on 100% fear, people tend to try to destroy what terrifies them.

I get the fear part with Negan. But do his people respect him??

Compare Negan to Rick.
Anytime Rick has gotten a little too violent or psycho, his crew starts giving hm that 'look' like maybe Rick has lost it and shouldn't be in control anymore.

And Rick's capacity for violence is nearly as great as Negan's.

You don't think if Rick could have killed every single on of those Saviors to rescue his own group, he wouldn't have done it???

Rick is a murderous psychopath too, but only under certain circumstances.
He has a code I sort of understand.
Negan?? Not really.


No, the writers of TWD don't have to explain why the Saviors follow Negan. Every one of the characters on TWD is broken in some way because of the upside down world they live in.

However as a fan it's hard to follow the logic of Negan's power, authority and control.
He just seems to be evil for evil's sake and for some reason the Saviors trust him with their lives.


Ironically, if Negan was the head of a smaller group, that would make more sense because it would suggest he had a hard time finding followers.

The problem is the Saviors are the largest group of survivors we've ever seen on TWD.

Why??

How can you speculate all that about Negan?? You don't know him. You don't know how he got started or why his followers are loyal. Wait and see to make your assumptions.

 

[The Dark King]

Who made the people follow Hitler??

And Remember, this is the apocalypse. You need numbers. Negan isn't making the most disappear Bc he want numbers.

Hitler appealed to their need for safety us vs them. He wasn't killing Germans he was killing Jews. Negan doesn't make that differentiation.

 

[Stizzy]

Hitler appealed to their need for safety us vs them. He wasn't killing Germans he was killing Jews. Negan doesn't make that differentiation.

Again, this is the apocalypse. Numbers are not plentiful.

Question, why isn't the hilltop with Negan? With him as in living at his compound.

 

[Stizzy]

My point, we don't know. It's too early to form all these assumptions

 

[archangel]

Hitler appealed to their need for safety us vs them. He wasn't killing Germans he was killing Jews. Negan doesn't make that differentiation.

Ha.... He killed handicap germans and pretty much any German that didn't fit his perception of a good german(along with lots of others). Hate never remains contained. Even the KKK have killed their own.

 

[The Dark King]

Ha.... He killed handicap germans and pretty much any German that didn't fit his perception of a good german(along with lots of others). Hate never remains contained. Even the KKK have killed their own.

You're missing the big point, he focused on unwanted minorities

 

[Ol'Skool Classic]

Negan isn't showing the Saviors he's a tough, strong leader.
He's demonstrating to his followers by pulverizing the skulls of Abraham and Glenn that he's a monster.

Have you been paying attention to the fact that most of the Savior's are just as sadistic as Negan is?


Did you notice the dude taking Polaroid shots of Glenn & Abraham's bashed in skulls?

Why are you assuming it's fear and intimidation that's keeping all the people who make up the actual Saviors in line?

 

[The Dark King]

Have you been paying attention to the fact that most of the Savior's are just as sadistic as Negan is?


Did you notice the dude taking Polaroid shots of Glenn & Abraham's bashed in skulls?

Why are you assuming it's fear and intimidation that's keeping all the people who make up the actual Saviors in line?

Because those kinds of people aren't good at follow the leader

 

[Ol'Skool Classic]

Because those kinds of people aren't good at follow the leader

In what world?


If you're about doing fucked up shit and someone comes along and basically enables you to or expands your ability to indulge in fucked up shit with no limits if you follow them, you're not going to have some type of loyalty to them until someone you believe to be better comes along? Really?

 

[darkcurry]

Have you been paying attention to the fact that most of the Savior's are just as sadistic as Negan is?


Did you notice the dude taking Polaroid shots of Glenn & Abraham's bashed in skulls?

Why are you assuming it's fear and intimidation that's keeping all the people who make up the actual Saviors in line?

That's the only thing that could make some what sense. They being just as sadistic and nutty as he is, but usually those kind of people have a thirst for power themselves. It's got to be brainwashing and that is a lot of people to brainwash. I would really like to know just how he came into power to clear this up.

 

[Ol'Skool Classic]

That's the only thing that could make some what sense. They being just as sadistic and nutty as he is, but usually those kind of people have a thirst for power themselves. It's got to be brainwashing and that is a lot of people to brainwash. I would really like to know just how he came into power to clear this up.

There's no brainwashing involved. It's basic primal status quo. Everybody is not an alpha dog type looking to be THE top dog in every situation. As long as they have some type of status and power, especially over anyone they perceive as weaker/beneath them, some people will go with the flow.

 

[The Dark King]

There's no brainwashing involved. It's basic primal status quo. Everybody is not an alpha dog type looking to be THE top dog in every situation. As long as they have some type of status and power, especially over anyone they perceive as weaker/beneath them, some people will go with the flow.

But the one piece I can't get pass is hey I'm a savior you're gonna give me half your shit you're gonna work for me oh and btw I'm gonna kill one of your friends to make a point I can. Who stays loyal in a situation like that?

 

[Ol'Skool Classic]

But the one piece I can't get pass is hey I'm a savior you're gonna give me half your shit you're gonna work for me oh and btw I'm gonna kill one of your friends to make a point I can. Who stays loyal in a situation like that?

If you stop looking at the entire situation from a rational and civilized perspective, the shit makes perfect sense. Stop looking at the zombies and the virus that created them as the threat to be overcome. Living humans are the threat. Always have been from the start.

Everything and everyone is now on the primal level. Everything is playing out on a pack/tribal level. Rick's group essentially started off for all intents and purposes as a pack. Coming to and joining Alexandra, they are now a tribe.


Think about all the various groups of people that have been shown since the second season. From that small group that Rick in crew encounter when they were on Hershel's farm, to Woodbury, Terminus, the Reavers that Darryl spent a short time, the Atlanta Hospital Group that took Beth, the Wolves and leading to Alexandria, Hilltop, The Saviors and the upcoming next week Kingdom, all of it is pack/tribal based in some manner.