Minnesota Interracial Dating/Marriage (article)

[SardonicGenie]

jeesh... this has got to be the stupidest argument I've ever read.

The way "men are portrayed as buffoons" on tv has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the plight of black men in society.

In fact, most of the men being portrayed as buffoons are WHITE, yet white men aren't the object of derision & spite that black men are. And most of the "buffoons" are presented as lovable buffoons, who are still good fathers, good husbands, etc., the type of guy that women can see themselves being with, & respect & aim for...

....Exactly the opposite of the way they see black men.

And even the pre-feminism tv guys (like on the honeymooners, etc.) were typically presented in the same "buffoonish" way.

---

Seven, your point is waaaay off anything I've written here.

:lol: what about black comedies? What say you? Also, the women in these comedies are portrayed as superior to men. This has plenty to do with how men are respected. It is called social brainwashing. How many times has one herd 'I don't need no man to make me happy, i'm independent?' Where do you think this mentality comes from? The media my friend. Again, look outside the box.

It doesn't ONLY come from the media. It is just portrayed throughout the media on American Television.

 

[SardonicGenie]

When you ask do "they" chose comedy roles, you are under the false impression that women have the power to make a choice. Most decisions are still made by white males in hollywood.

Oh, but dont let logic get in your way of blaming women for not allowing men to be men. That argument also keeps me laughing.

Again, it is not letting men be men, it is telling men, HOW to be men. There is a huge difference in the two.

At least I thought there was a difference. :wink:

 

[SardonicGenie]

what about black comedies? What say you? Also, the women in these comedies are portrayed as superior to men. This has plenty to do with how men are respected. It is called social brainwashing. How many times has one herd 'I don't need no man to make me happy, i'm independent?' Where do you think this mentality comes from? The media my friend. Again, look outside the box.

Honestly guy, your point is so ludicrous I won't even argue with it.

Obviously, what black men go through is in no way connected with the way men are portrayed on sitcoms. :roll: There is media influence, but that ain't it.

How do you know for sure if it isn't? Some black women really do watch those shows on UPN. I said SOME, not all.

 

[SardonicGenie]

what about black comedies? What say you? Also, the women in these comedies are portrayed as superior to men. This has plenty to do with how men are respected. It is called social brainwashing. How many times has one herd 'I don't need no man to make me happy, I'm independent?' Where do you think this mentality comes from? The media my friend. Again, look outside the box.

Honestly guy, your point is so ludicrous I won't even argue with it.

Obviously, what black men go through is in no way connected with the way men are portrayed on sitcoms. :roll: There is media influence, but that ain't it.

Sigh......another person who can not see past what is being said. I'm not arguing against your points. I'm not just talking in terms of just sitcoms. I thought this was understood. I'm speaking generally about the Ms. Princess like mentality behaivour. Yes. Which is very much influenced by media. Which in turn affects what EVERY man goes though. This is the point in which i bought forth.

For the most part, it's enforced by the media, rather than just influenced.

 

[D. White]

WOW I live in Minnesota (moved here from California) "born/raised in Pennsylvania" . I had no idea it was so turbulent here. For those not from here life in rural Minnesota (where I live) is NOTHING like life in the Metro (Minneapolis/StPaul) for the uninitiated. Most of what I read here only applies to the "Metro" area as I see it. There are only a hand full of "non-whites" that live "out state" MN. For example I live in Faribault County which has a Black population of approx 15 blacks in all in a county with a total population of approx. 8,000 to 10,000 people (can't recall last census figures exactly). I am a black male who lives alone here and there are virtually NO black women here. I must drive 150 miles to find Black women "in any numbers at all" meaning I must drive to Minneapolis/StPaul. If you have ever tried to talk to a "city girl" black woman... well you get the idea, and I don't have time for the drama. This has not been a huge problem as I personally prefer the company of white women. I can stroll past a ww and smile and say hello and they will nearly every time respond with a warm smile and reply. On the other hand the Black women I meet in public usually roll their eyes and say something like "who you talkin' to" or "what chu' lookin' at" . Not a very warm welcome for a possible suitor. I got turned off to bw years ago in large part because of them. I just don't like playing the "game"

 

[solar flair]

I was speaking in general terms about how men are represented in the media, and there are people who are influenced by what they see in the media. You seemed to have missed that.

-- Men control the images in the media...
-- Men have been portrayed as "lovable buffoons" since pre-feminism days, images which in fact supported paternalism...
-- White men are portrayed as "lovable buffoons" even moreso than blacks, yet their experience in society is a lot easier than black men's, to say the least...
-- Black men were an object of derision in this society way before there was tv or even mass media...

SardonicGenie, you "seem to have missed" all this... Don't get belligerent. Your stance flies in the face of all logic, & you're getting "prissy" about it. Jeesh. :roll:

The way men are portrayed (largely BY men) on tv, has very little to do with the plight of black men in this country, nor with the attitudes of bw toward bm, and sitcoms (7seven's villain) have *nothing* to do with it...

-----

Now back to topic: BM choosing ww in droves in Minnesota...

BW "attitudes", in my opinion, come out of the gulf between the way they see themselves and the female ideal presented in mass media, and the sense of betrayal and abandonment represented by BM's (potential) access to that ideal female, particularly in the (perceived) absence of any real alternative to black men for single black women.

I think it all has to do with issues of insecurity, marketability, and, of course, the history. Some might say that "early heartbreaks" and "shoddy treatment" have something to do with it, but frankly I think that's bullshit.

...And keep in mind: one of the reasons bw see few alternatives to bm as mates is because they're largely not attracted to white men, for a number of reasons. I think bw are even less attracted to wm than wm are to bw.

On top of that, bw have the perception that wm will sleep with bw & still see bm as the enemy (as in slavery times). Most bw aren't very down with that (which explains why so many bw who get with white men are extremely belligerent toward bm: that is, only a certain type are "crossing over".)

----

...Anyway, add to this mix the fact that there's no taboo against showing hatred toward bm in this society, and you're going to experience a lot of hatred even as you're minding your own business, particularly if you're the type of bm that bw think someone else might want.

One time, during one of the loneliest periods of my life, a bw once said to me in conversation "So I guess *you* can get whatever kind of woman you want!" I get the feeling that bw think bm have a *much* easier time in the dating game than we actually do. They don't understand that for every woman who appreciates a bm's personal assets, there are *many* who instead resent him for it, and aim to "cut him down a notch".

WW, in their more secure position, are less likely to take that tact, and are that much more attractive by comparison...

---

Of course my explanation above doesn't cover all the reasons behind the rift betw/ bw & bm, nor attraction betw/ bm & ww in minnesota, but I think this is a big part of what's at the heart of it. In fact, I'd bet that the more ww & bm hook up in minnesota, the more bm are going to actually *need* ww there, because bw's attitudes will get even worse...

 

[SardonicGenie]

I was speaking in general terms about how men are represented in the media, and there are people who are influenced by what they see in the media. You seemed to have missed that.

-- Men control the images in the media...
-- Men have been portrayed as "lovable buffoons" since pre-feminism days, images which in fact supported paternalism...
-- White men are portrayed as "lovable buffoons" even moreso than blacks, yet their experience in society is a lot easier than black men's, to say the least...
-- Black men were an object of derision in this society way before there was tv or even mass media...

SardonicGenie, you "seem to have missed" all this... Don't get belligerent. Your stance flies in the face of all logic, & you're getting "prissy" about it. Jeesh. :roll:

The way men are portrayed (largely BY men) on tv, has very little to do with the plight of black men in this country, nor with the attitudes of bw toward bm, and sitcoms (7seven's villain) have *nothing* to do with it...

My point still applies. Just because white men control the images doesn't mean the media isn't becoming more feminized. You still missed that somehow.

-----

Now back to topic: BM choosing ww in droves in Minnesota...

BW "attitudes", in my opinion, come out of the gulf between the way they see themselves and the female ideal presented in mass media, and the sense of betrayal and abandonment represented by BM's (potential) access to that ideal female, particularly in the (perceived) absence of any real alternative to black men for single black women.

I think it all has to do with issues of insecurity, marketability, and, of course, the history. Some might say that "early heartbreaks" and "shoddy treatment" have something to do with it, but frankly I think that's bullshit.

...And keep in mind: one of the reasons bw see few alternatives to bm as mates is because they're largely not attracted to white men, for a number of reasons. I think bw are even less attracted to wm than wm are to bw.

On top of that, bw have the perception that wm will sleep with bw & still see bm as the enemy (as in slavery times). Most bw aren't very down with that (which explains why so many bw who get with white men are extremely belligerent toward bm: that is, only a certain type are "crossing over".)

----

...Anyway, add to this mix the fact that there's no taboo against showing hatred toward bm in this society, and you're going to experience a lot of hatred even as you're minding your own business, particularly if you're the type of bm that bw think someone else might want.

One time, during one of the loneliest periods of my life, a bw once said to me in conversation "So I guess *you* can get whatever kind of woman you want!" I get the feeling that bw think bm have a *much* easier time in the dating game than we actually do. They don't understand that for every woman who appreciates a bm's personal assets, there are *many* who instead resent him for it, and aim to "cut him down a notch".

WW, in their more secure position, are less likely to take that tact, and are that much more attractive by comparison...

---

Of course my explanation above doesn't cover all the reasons behind the rift betw/ bw & bm, nor attraction betw/ bm & ww in minnesota, but I think this is a big part of what's at the heart of it. In fact, I'd bet that the more ww & bm hook up in minnesota, the more bm are going to actually *need* ww there, because bw's attitudes will get even worse...

I pretty much agree with this part.

 

[solar flair]

My point still applies. Just because white men control the images doesn't mean the media isn't becoming more feminized. You still missed that somehow.

:roll:

As if your points are "crystal clear"... lol

dude, your logic is just a mess...

Well, if men control these "buffoonish" media images & the media is becoming more "feminized", then maybe "feminization" is a good thing. Maybe we'll all be better off once women have more of a hand in it than we are now, with men controlling it... How about that?...

---

Now maybe we can get more comments that are on-topic. The minnesota phenomenon is very interesting. Here's a question for you minnesotans: are there many black people in the urban centers there?

I ask because I'm thinking that among urban minnesotans, it's a relatively large percentage of a small black population that mixes, fueling the phenomenon... and a very small percentage of a large white population that mixes. Is that accurate?

 

[SardonicGenie]

My point still applies. Just because white men control the images doesn't mean the media isn't becoming more feminized. You still missed that somehow.

:roll:

As if your points are "crystal clear"... lol

dude, your logic is just a mess...

Well, if men control these "buffoonish" media images & the media is becoming more "feminized", then maybe "feminization" is a good thing. Maybe we'll all be better off once women have more of a hand in it than we are now, with men controlling it... How about that?...

This is how you see it. I already made my point, whether you agree or not.

---

Now maybe we can get more comments that are on-topic. The minnesota phenomenon is very interesting. Here's a question for you minnesotans: are there many black people in the urban centers there?

I ask because I'm thinking that among urban minnesotans, it's a relatively large percentage of a small black population that mixes, fueling the phenomenon... and a very small percentage of a large white population that mixes. Is that accurate?

I'll let you decide.

 

[Lexington]

Re: wowsa

I live in Minnesota and i know why this is. There are many sides to this. White woman tend to be extra nurturing. Meaning some like to pay for bills for men and all kinds of crazy stuff. I know a few black woman so now i am not speaking for all of them but alot of the men here have dogged out the black woman and they are like forget it i wont deal with your crap. So since this is the case they go over to the white woman who put up with everything under the sun. Now again not all white woman are like this.

However the article wasn't completely true the ratio of black woman dating white woman is huge in fact its as common as black men with white woman if not more common so this article is completely inaccurate.
A lot of good white woman find it hard to find the good black men. In fact i find it easier to date men who are not from here originally. I will not date black men who have lived in Minnesota all of there lives as they have no clue how to treat a woman.
Just my 2 cents.

Last year someone sent me the first article by this columnist, and told me that BW there, for the most part, have turned there backs almost completely on BM in Minnesota and were going for everything but BM these days. I wasn't sure if I believed it, but your comments are pretty much in line with what I was told. I grew up with a guy who left town and turned out to be a pimp in Minnesota, and so were his all buddies. He said one of his girls' father committed suicide because he had her out working. Some of the pimps even had children with women in their stable. The word has long been out about Minnesota, Denver and Seattle.

 

[solar flair]

So now that it's established that bm are lazy victimizers, which is why they like ww in minnesota, anyone have a clue as to why ww go for black men in minnesota?

 

[Lexington]

How many times has one herd 'I don't need no man to make me happy, i'm independent?'

Wrong example to use. I think it is a good thing that women feel that they don't need a man to be happy, and that they are independent. That's exactly how I feel. I don't need a woman to make me happy. Doesn't mean that I wouldn't want one. However, people should not search for a mate just to make themselves happy.

A lot of people miss the logic in that statement. There's nothing wrong in being independent, selective and being happy with yourself "first".

 

[Lexington]

So now that it's established that bm are lazy victimizers, which is why they like ww in minnesota, anyone have a clue as to why ww go for black men in minnesota?

There's a thread with comments about some WW claiming to give up on WM without giving BM a chance. When some of them become disillusioned with WM they, in fact, do branch out to nonwhite men.

 

[SardonicGenie]

So now that it's established that bm are lazy victimizers, which is why they like ww in minnesota, anyone have a clue as to why ww go for black men in minnesota?

There's a thread with comments about some WW claiming to give up on WM without giving BM a chance. When some of them become disillusioned with WM they, in fact, do branch out to nonwhite men.

Not in ALL cases. Like you said, only some.

 

[Lexington]

So now that it's established that bm are lazy victimizers, which is why they like ww in minnesota, anyone have a clue as to why ww go for black men in minnesota?

There's a thread with comments about some WW claiming to give up on WM without giving BM a chance. When some of them become disillusioned with WM they, in fact, do branch out to nonwhite men.

Not in ALL cases. Like you said, only some.

I think WW are more apt to branch out to nonwhite men than to "go girl". The same can be said for other women as well since it's possible to continue living without a man. I think for a woman to "go girl" they have a predisposition for it anyway. If I was turned off by men...dealing with women would not be an option for me...that's why I don't really understand folks turning gay just because they are incarcerated...you just have to do without. After reading that first article by the columnist in the opening post, I did some research and came across comments by a white Canadian woman of Italian descent who dated IR. When she was younger she couldn't stand the sight of Italian men dating fair skinned blondes of other nationalities. Now that many WM are dating Asian women, she said that WW could still fall back on latino and blacks in their dating pool so there was no reason for them to be concerned.

 

[SardonicGenie]

I don't know, Lex, if I can say that more of them are willing to try and date non-white men, maybe in a foreign nation, but that's not always the case anywhere in the world.

 

[SardonicGenie]

And, just like you and Fly said, yes, I do believe that if many women choose to 'go girl', then she was a lesbian/bisexual to begin with, and that she intended to all along.

 

[7Seven]

My point still applies. Just because white men control the images doesn't mean the media isn't becoming more feminized. You still missed that somehow.

:roll:

As if your points are "crystal clear"... lol

dude, your logic is just a mess...

Well, if men control these "buffoonish" media images & the media is becoming more "feminized", then maybe "feminization" is a good thing. Maybe we'll all be better off once women have more of a hand in it than we are now, with men controlling it... How about that?...

Yes, men control media play, but THE BOTTOM LINE IS CAS$H!!!!!!!!!!!! That is the only reason. They cater to their audience. Geesshhh there is no point of me explaining business tactics. I'll leave it at that. It is no point of men explaining business tactics, it's too technical for most to understand. Greed and corruption I guess you let that logic pass over your head heh? It is all political.

 

[CiViC SpiKeS]

Based on that article looks like i need visit minnesota sometime then :lol:

But unfortunately i live in Nazi York along with solar.

 

[tuckerreed]

What do they want? A medal? They have attitudes which drive all men away not just black men. They dont keep themselves up and when they do they think they are better than black men. The only black women who are worth dating are African women, who are often better kept and better educated.

if the sister drops the I am so above all black men act then they would be chosen but if you go up to a sister in a cafe or bar, her nose is so far in the air and for what, most are hood rats out of the working and lower classes who go financial aid and loans for school and so they are not better than anyone else.