TRUMP Thread

We can have both to a certain degree.

 

Don't worry bro I'm just reporting the insults.:mrgreen:

 

800%? From what raw number? If there was one before, adding 8 is an 800% increase. Hardly a deluge.

I would have believed you about Mexican immigration causing a population spike, because the bulk of the immigration comes from agricultural peasant communities. However, if you dig a bit deeper, you will find that by the second generation, birth rates fall to US native levels - because relative prosperity and access to education, particularly among women, lowers birth rates.

Your statement about California being "theirs" is an oversimplification. First of all, it was 'theirs' before it was 'ours', as part of Mexico. The US Southwest from TX to Northern CA already had a resident Mexican population since the 1800s. Lines have shifted according to wars and border skirmishes between the two as well as land purchases. I do not support illegal immigration, but I do support increasing the number of visas available for potential immigrants.

Much of this hemisphere's poverty is a direct corollary of US policies supporting the super-exploitation of US agribusiness and mining interests in those countries. Much of the surge in Mexican immigration of the last 20 years was a direct coefficient of NAFTA, which decimated Mexican corn farmers and flooded South American markets with US-manufactured GMO corn. The unemployed migrants had no where to go but where? Due north...looking for work. US international exploitation and intervention in the hemisphere in the last 50 years includes the following countries:

Haiti
Dominican Republic
Nicaragua
Honduras
El Salvador
Mexico (via NAFTA, not direct military intervention)
Chile
Peru
Colombia
Venezuela
Brazil
Puerto Rico
Virgin Islands
Guatemala
Grenada
Cuba (thank the US and the mafia if you're pissed about Fidel)
Panama

So if we're going to attack someone for the deluge of migrants (which has subsided significantly since the 2008 economic crisis since there aren't any jobs to be had), thank your countrymen for their votes and the US administrations we have put in place since WWII, in particular.

First of all, you don't know what I would say or wouldn't say. Mexicans (legal or illegal) are NOT killing us as black people in any significant number. The masses of EVERY ethnic group are killed by those within their own ethnic community. I realize that there is significant African-American/Mexican tension in CA, TX, IL and a few other states, particularly among gang members of both groups. I would submit to you that the problem might have its origins in criminal activity more so (or at least as much as) than in narrow racial/ethnic hatred.

As for the larger issue of immigration, I have a class, rather than a national perspective. While I do not support the commission of any illegal act, there are relative levels of seriousness involved in one infraction versus another. As black people we are not allowed to participate in any meaningful way in the economic or political life of this nation, despite the enormous contribution our ancestors made in blood, sweat and tears under conditions of frightening violence. Nevertheless, the racist white reactionary wing of conservative political circles comes now to the black community to get us to support the latest ethnic pogrom du jour. And when they're done, they'll get right back to the business of anti-black oppression.

I will not support taking this country back from anyone except racists and the capitalist class. The real crimes against humanity are those committed by them, not by the impoverished poor, peasantry and working class of another ethnic/racial group. And if anyone has a right to "take back" anything, it's the indigenous people of this land who have been reduced to serfs on their own land.

As Martin Niemoller once said:

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me. "

 

TO a certain degree yes but that is not what this country is known for. I mean look at this stop and frisk. I'm sure it was painted to catch the bad guys. But the police use that crap to stop anyone. It has become nothing more than legal harassment especially for minorities. You should be able to walk down the streets without being asked for your papers or being made to feel like a second rate citizens. If they can't use the powers correctly, then they shouldn't have it all.

:smt012

 

Ok so what's a viable solution then?

 

Tried to rep you but the MAN said I had to spread the wealth.
(The mods need to change this useless rule.smh:smt101)

 

Increased border security, extremely harsh penalties for businesses that hire them (which is NEVER on the policy menu...I wonder why? ) and even worse penalties for those that pay below minimum wages, and a higher minimum wage (to remove the incentive to exploit the undocumented for wage arbitrage). They come for work. Punish the exploiter, not the exploited, and you will see a decline in the infraction. Just like with drugs, prostitution or other social ill. Punish suppliers, not the little people at the end of the supply chain.

Don't you just love how racists want us to now help them as "Americans" (when they have never treated us as such) in their offensive against another people? They don't even offer anything in return (i.e. addressing racism within their own ranks, etc), but instead seek to foster a false consciousness within us to get us to identify with our oppressor. Reminds me of how the slave master wanted slaves to fight for the Confederacy...

In the words of the immortal Hall and Oates...

[YOUTUBE]ccenFp_3kq8[/YOUTUBE]

 

Make the ones in already legal. I have been against it for a while but that's the reality. You can't pull them out of the country. It would be a great idea to build a fence but I know that is not realistic. The rich make too much off of the low wages. It would also cost the country too much to build.

Note: I am only making the illegal immigrants legal only to make it harder for folks to hire them over qualified Americans. You will have to pay them a fair wage and benefits. That will force employers to employ Americans again. The hole in my plan is that some people are willing to work with no benefits or with low wages(average for a waitress is 2 dollars and change I think?). I'd have to fix that which would help Americans in the long run because I would require all jobs to have benefits and a minimum wage of 7 dollars(private or public). Of course, I'd be hit by the employer with the I can't stay in business commet. I'd be cold and heartless. If you can't afford benefits for your employees then you shouldn't be in business. I'm tired of paying for the social welfare that you should be paying for. Other option is to just tax it out them so that I can use that to pay the welfare.

 

oh man awesome pic.

 

My sentiments exactly. No one can "steal" your job unless your current employer decides to hire that person over you. Those of us who aren't one percenters often forget that. They're addicted to cheap labor because having to pay workers more cuts into their bottom line and we can't have that, now can we?

 

Why not? It's the law. In fact, you will not be issued a card by DHS/INS unless you agree to that. You promised that at any time a law enforcement or immigration officer asked you to produce your ID, you wil. I signed it. Every legal imigrant did, too. It's part of the privilege to live here.

 

Nice try. The sanctuary was voted in last year. Mayor Nutter was voted in 3 years prior to it.

 

The one percent who control the policy apparatus turn one worker against another, all the while missing their ultimate culpability in the entire state of affairs. Divide and conquer continues to work wonders, both among black people and with other races.

They throw us off track with a pseudo-solution: 1 group of workers (white workers) get another group of workers that we exploit even more than you (black workers) to go after another group of workers (immigrant workers), even while we know that you're just spinning your wheels in the mud because we control the levers of what ultimately drives migration levels. And when they want more migrants, they will get them, whether we support it or not. Never forget that the massive ag workers influx was to feed a specific US program (requested by agribusiness) - the bracero (strong arms) program - to get cheap fruit and vegetable pickers on a seasonal basis.

I love how punishing them for their exploitation of the working class is never up for discussion. Ever.

 

Hey orejon you may want to read the articles i posted...very interesting

 

Thanks, goodlove. Checking them out now.

 

GL and Arch, here is the story on the visa l mentioned earlier..gotta fix this (illegal) loophole...Jobs ARE being stolen.

http://www.newsmax.com/t/#!newsmax/article/626335

Thousands of California Workers Lose Jobs to H-1B Visa Immigrants

By Courtney Coren
Monday, 23 Feb 2015 12:19 PM

Southern California Edison has laid off thousands of its IT employees and replaced them with lower-paid workers from India with H-1B visas.

The electric company, which provides services to almost 14 million customers in the Southern California region, was able to do this because of a loophole in the nation's immigration law, the Los Angeles Times is reporting.

The immigration statute Southern California Edison has been able to exploit allows the company to hire employees with H-1B visas. These are temporary work permits, which are given to foreigners who have "specialty occupations" that require "highly specialized knowledge" and a bachelor's degree.

While the purpose of the H-1B visas is to allow employers to hire foreigners for positions in which they can't find enough sufficiently trained American workers, it is not supposed to be used to hire cheaper labor from other countries, as is the case with Southern California Edison, the Times is reporting.

"Americans should be outraged that most of our politicians sit idly by while outsourcing firms hijack the nation’s temporary foreign worker programs," according to Ron Hira of The Economic Policy Institute at Howard University.

"A majority of H-1B visas are now being used by firms that displace American workers and facilitate the offshoring of high-wage jobs," he added.

According to Hira, hiring Indian IT employees via outsourcing allows the electric company to save as much as 40 percent in wage costs.

Edison's American employees earned $80,000 to $160,000 per year, not including benefits. The average salary for experienced workers is about $120,000 per year.
The Indian workers make $65,000 to $71,000 per year, accord to the tax filings of the Indian outsourcing firms, Tata Consultancy Services and Infosys, providing labor to Edison. Those two firms are among the largest recipients of H-1B visas.

"They told us they could replace one of us with three, four, or five Indian personnel and still save money," one laid-off Edison worker told The Times.

"They said, 'We can get four Indian guys for cheaper than the price of you.' You could hear a pin drop in the room," the worker added.

In addition, the laid-off workers argue that their jobs aren't that specialized to justify the hiring of foreign labor.

According to the Times, Edison argues that it's not exploiting the law because its not the one hiring the foreign workers, but that the outsourcing companies are doing the hiring.

Both companies have faced legal scrutiny in the past, although they deny any wrongdoing. Tata faced a class-action lawsuit by workers, alleging that the firm cheated them out of their wages and U.S. tax refund checks, which was settled in 2013 for $29.8 million.

Infosys was fined $34 million by the Justice Department over allegedly defrauding immigration officials.

According to ComputerWorld, the Senate has taken notice of the Edison layoffs.

Alabama Sen. Jeff Sessions, chairman of the Senate Immigration Subcommittee, mentioned the layoffs in a speech in early February criticizing H-1B visas. In that speech, he said that Edison is hiring "foreign employees who have come in under the H-1B visa program for the sole purpose of taking a job ... and they work for less pay too often."

Sessions says that President Barack Obama wants to double the number of H-1B visas, which the Alabama Republican says is already "a growing problem in the high-tech industry."

*Computer World also did a story on it
http://www.computerworld.com/articl...rs-beyond-furious-over-h-1b-replacements.html

 

This is a disgrace, but trust me, it's no mistake. The firms exploiting this are the ones who lobbyied for it.

 

Exactly. Its in the other links i posted that is similar to this. Im not overly worried about just the illegals ....its the whole thing. They are playing "look at the mexicans...the illegals" but then they do an end a round with the white collar jibs that bring in the big bucks.

 

This is America. You know we can't have rich folks job creators be responsible for anything they do.

 

And it's all driven by...you guessed it. Capitalists.

Ain't that the truth.